10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
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21-01-2014, 02:25 PM (This post was last modified: 21-01-2014 02:29 PM by Raptor Jesus.)
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(19-01-2014 10:34 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(18-01-2014 10:14 PM)Alla Wrote:  P.S. taboos are from Lucifer not from God and not from His Church.

I know I already said this "...is easily one of the dumbest fucking things you have ever posted...", but I said no more because I didn't want to spoil my weekend. Now I'm back at work and so I can give this a better explanation.


Taboo
-A social or religious custom prohibiting or forbidding discussion of a particular practice or forbidding association with a particular person, place, or thing.


Taboos are social, they come from and are reinforced by society; and society is made up of people. All of your taboos are man made Alla. How do I know this? Because all the information your taboos are built upon comes from information supplied to you by other humans. Some of it comes from books you believe to be holy, but those books are the works of men; even if they claim to be divinely inspired or taking dictation from angels, the books are still the works of fallible men. The religions built around them were maintained, taught, and passed down by men. All of the social and cultural information you use to derive what is and is not taboo comes from other humans; not Satan, and certainly not God. Your taboos come from your peers, your family, your teachers, your culture, and yes even your Church; they are all the source of your taboos. Get the fuck over it and stop blaming an imaginary bogeyman for the bullshit humans make up. Drinking Beverage

Plus...

the fact that taboos vary from culture to culture is very telling of them being man made.

...
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21-01-2014, 02:39 PM (This post was last modified: 21-01-2014 02:50 PM by Raptor Jesus.)
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(20-01-2014 06:11 PM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  
(20-01-2014 05:24 PM)Alla Wrote:  thanks.
So, what do you like to talk about the most? and what threads are the best on this forum that we can talk about other interesting things?


There's an introduction thread Alla that would provide the chance for you to tell us more about yourself. We've already kinda trekked off the OP in this thread. LOL

And maybe, Alla, if you do that, you could explain why you are here. Not in life, but here on this forum. I don't say that to imply, to mean you should not be. It's fine for you to be here, but given your point of view, your insistence that others accept your point of view, and your seeming refusal to actually try to understand anyone else's point of view, what is the reason you choose to spend so much time here, in this particular fourm?

...
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21-01-2014, 02:43 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 02:39 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  
(20-01-2014 06:11 PM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  There's an introduction thread Alla that would provide the chance for you to tell us more about yourself. We've already kinda trekked off the OP in this thread. LOL

And maybe, Alla, if you do that, you could explain why you are here. Not in life, but here on this forum. I don't say that to imply to mean you should not be. It's fine to be here, but giving your point of view, your insistence that others accept your point of view, and your seeming refusal to actually try to understand anyone else's point of view, what is the reason you choose to spend so much time here, in this particular fourm?

Well said Raptor. Thanks Heart

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21-01-2014, 03:57 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 02:01 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  
(19-01-2014 04:24 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  Hey Dark Phoenix, with what I have just said to msbb in mind, I'm glad you're sharing your experiences on here in a constructive way. Other people looking for answers like I was as a teenager may stumble across this and get a fuller picture of LDS and make more informed decisions. ... From a selfish perspective I got something out of mak posting on here and do believe there is indeed a more progressive element in LDS but I still hold more than a strong suspicion that not only is it not the majority but a very small minority. Great posts, keep up the good work! I really enjoy reading them! Thumbsup

Thank for your constant encouragement and your willingness to back me up to Maklelan even before you knew what I would say on my own behalf. It put a welcome smile on my face to see you agree with my experience.

It is my desire to be the voice of explanation that I wish I had access to when I was searching the internet for answers about my faith. I know I can't possibly be alone, since the internet is only becoming more commonplace as time passes. There must be others, like I was, who are looking for answers. Perhaps I can do them the favor of pioneering in some small way.

As far as this "progressive element" within the church, I find it shallow and deceptive. Picking and choosing one's beliefs from a doctrine that clearly says not to do that, is by definition, dishonest and ridiculous. I can attack them for the same reasons, and with the same arguments, as I attack religious moderation everywhere else.

Thanks again.

And I thank you too for being here and being courageous and standing up against the tsunami of bullshit. Thumbsup

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21-01-2014, 04:15 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 02:01 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  
(19-01-2014 04:24 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  Hey Dark Phoenix, with what I have just said to msbb in mind, I'm glad you're sharing your experiences on here in a constructive way. Other people looking for answers like I was as a teenager may stumble across this and get a fuller picture of LDS and make more informed decisions. ... From a selfish perspective I got something out of mak posting on here and do believe there is indeed a more progressive element in LDS but I still hold more than a strong suspicion that not only is it not the majority but a very small minority. Great posts, keep up the good work! I really enjoy reading them! Thumbsup

Thank for your constant encouragement and your willingness to back me up to Maklelan even before you knew what I would say on my own behalf. It put a welcome smile on my face to see you agree with my experience.

It is my desire to be the voice of explanation that I wish I had access to when I was searching the internet for answers about my faith. I know I can't possibly be alone, since the internet is only becoming more commonplace as time passes. There must be others, like I was, who are looking for answers. Perhaps I can do them the favor of pioneering in some small way.

As far as this "progressive element" within the church, I find it shallow and deceptive. Picking and choosing one's beliefs from a doctrine that clearly says not to do that, is by definition, dishonest and ridiculous. I can attack them for the same reasons, and with the same arguments, as I attack religious moderation everywhere else.

Thanks again.



DarkP your posts were really moving, real and very clear. Thank you for taking the time to tell us so much. I learn more every time you explain.

When I want your opinion I'll read your entrails.
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21-01-2014, 04:56 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 01:55 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  
Quote: I said:"I wish it was true" that you feel happier but not because you left the Church. I wish it was the true that you actually continually feel more content and happy as you go along. I believe that your desire to criticize Church and Mormonism is evidence that you have some bitterness which can not bring much happiness.

Yet again, you show your unwillingness to accept my experience as being honest. It doesn't seem to matter to you how many times I tell you that I am happier today, you are simply unwilling to believe it. Since it does not match your world view, you discard it as being automatically false. You are, by definition, engaged in the exact mental filter that I have criticized so often. Your faith, and the things taught to you by your church, cause you to refuse to accept anything that contradicts those beliefs. In a way, you are a living example of the taboo, which you do not seem to understand at all, even when the definition is given to you.

Quote:Not at all. I don't know your mind and heart. But I know how joy of hate feels. That's all I said.

Honestly, I don't care if it makes you, or has made you, feel better to criticize something for the sole purpose of feeling better. I find it shallow and empty as a pursuit. As I have already said, I am engaged in something entirely different.

Don't expect me not to notice that by saying that you "know what it is like", you make the assumption that your experience matches my own. This is the original condescension that I took issue with, and that I still do.

Quote: You are my brother because we are children of the same covenant. And because we have the same Father.

I was absolutely clear when I told you not to say this again. The first time, I can excuse you for being ignorant of what offends me, but now I will not be so understanding. This is the second time you have crossed this line, and I now understand that you have no interest whatsoever in being polite or considerate. You wish to be respected for your faith, yet you fail to show me respect when I ask for it, and then do so again, knowing full well that it was offensive to me.

We are in no sense family, not even in the ridiculous non-existent realm of the spiritual. You are not my sister, and we do not share the same father. In fact, you happen to represent a great many ideas that I consider to be immoral, harmful, and factually false, which by definition, makes them evil and worth attacking. You are engaged in a conversation with your enemy, even if you are unable to see that.

Quote:"Book of Mormon is true because my mom knows this" is not a testimony I was talking about. Borrowed testimony is like borrowed light. If you don't have your own light what are you going to do when there is no one from whom you can borrow it?

I don't think there is a single living person who has anything better than "borrowed light", as you so tediously put it. Faith is by definition lacking in actual evidence. To say that "I know", as the members so often do even when they are mere children, is nothing more than a socially acceptable lie. Even those with "strong personal testimonies" merely believe. They do not know for certain. The church teaches the ridiculous idea that through practicing faith, one can attain actual knowledge. As anyone with an education in modern science can tell you, faith is the worst possible means of learning what is true.

I had the best testimony that one can have. I believed it because I had faith in the doctrine, and also in my family. You wouldn't so easily dismiss that, as you have tried to do, if it were an active member writing in my place. I find your discrimination hypocritical.

Quote:To criticize is action. To criticize because it makes you feel better is action.

Here you betray your lack of understanding the term "action". You missed my entire point. As a side benefit for me, you managed to simultaneously prove my earlier point, by admitting that you do, in fact, think I criticize only in order to relieve my supposed "bitterness". You manage a dazzling marriage of ignorance, arrogance, and stupidity. It's quite breathtaking when you take the time to go through it all.

Quote:You know that moral agency is a gift from God and only Lucifer wants to take it from us, not God and not Church.

Here you go telling me what I "know" again. For your third language, you manage an incredible amount of intellectual dishonesty. It really is pathetic to need to resort to putting words in other's mouths all the time.

(18-01-2014 09:15 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  If you try anything like those three examples again, I will no longer speak with you.

I made my position clear earlier. You have openly trodden upon my request for consideration, even when you know exactly what you were doing. I will have nothing more to do with you. Be on your way.

This discussion is at it's end.

OK. To tell you the truth it really doesn't matter for me why you left the Church and why you are an Atheist.

English is not my native language.
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21-01-2014, 05:00 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 04:56 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(21-01-2014 01:55 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  Yet again, you show your unwillingness to accept my experience as being honest. It doesn't seem to matter to you how many times I tell you that I am happier today, you are simply unwilling to believe it. Since it does not match your world view, you discard it as being automatically false. You are, by definition, engaged in the exact mental filter that I have criticized so often. Your faith, and the things taught to you by your church, cause you to refuse to accept anything that contradicts those beliefs. In a way, you are a living example of the taboo, which you do not seem to understand at all, even when the definition is given to you.


Honestly, I don't care if it makes you, or has made you, feel better to criticize something for the sole purpose of feeling better. I find it shallow and empty as a pursuit. As I have already said, I am engaged in something entirely different.

Don't expect me not to notice that by saying that you "know what it is like", you make the assumption that your experience matches my own. This is the original condescension that I took issue with, and that I still do.


I was absolutely clear when I told you not to say this again. The first time, I can excuse you for being ignorant of what offends me, but now I will not be so understanding. This is the second time you have crossed this line, and I now understand that you have no interest whatsoever in being polite or considerate. You wish to be respected for your faith, yet you fail to show me respect when I ask for it, and then do so again, knowing full well that it was offensive to me.

We are in no sense family, not even in the ridiculous non-existent realm of the spiritual. You are not my sister, and we do not share the same father. In fact, you happen to represent a great many ideas that I consider to be immoral, harmful, and factually false, which by definition, makes them evil and worth attacking. You are engaged in a conversation with your enemy, even if you are unable to see that.


I don't think there is a single living person who has anything better than "borrowed light", as you so tediously put it. Faith is by definition lacking in actual evidence. To say that "I know", as the members so often do even when they are mere children, is nothing more than a socially acceptable lie. Even those with "strong personal testimonies" merely believe. They do not know for certain. The church teaches the ridiculous idea that through practicing faith, one can attain actual knowledge. As anyone with an education in modern science can tell you, faith is the worst possible means of learning what is true.

I had the best testimony that one can have. I believed it because I had faith in the doctrine, and also in my family. You wouldn't so easily dismiss that, as you have tried to do, if it were an active member writing in my place. I find your discrimination hypocritical.


Here you betray your lack of understanding the term "action". You missed my entire point. As a side benefit for me, you managed to simultaneously prove my earlier point, by admitting that you do, in fact, think I criticize only in order to relieve my supposed "bitterness". You manage a dazzling marriage of ignorance, arrogance, and stupidity. It's quite breathtaking when you take the time to go through it all.


Here you go telling me what I "know" again. For your third language, you manage an incredible amount of intellectual dishonesty. It really is pathetic to need to resort to putting words in other's mouths all the time.


I made my position clear earlier. You have openly trodden upon my request for consideration, even when you know exactly what you were doing. I will have nothing more to do with you. Be on your way.

This discussion is at it's end.

OK. To tell you the truth it really doesn't matter for me why you left the Church and why you are an Atheist.



But in a humanitarian stance and as Member of the forum.......you could show interest; particularly since there is such depth shared in DP's posts.

If you want to prove the words you say here about your religion holds any validity at all - then this is one of those times when action speaks louder than words.
What action will you choose?

You should care.
You really should.

When I want your opinion I'll read your entrails.
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21-01-2014, 05:33 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 02:01 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  
(19-01-2014 04:24 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  Hey Dark Phoenix, with what I have just said to msbb in mind, I'm glad you're sharing your experiences on here in a constructive way. Other people looking for answers like I was as a teenager may stumble across this and get a fuller picture of LDS and make more informed decisions. ... From a selfish perspective I got something out of mak posting on here and do believe there is indeed a more progressive element in LDS but I still hold more than a strong suspicion that not only is it not the majority but a very small minority. Great posts, keep up the good work! I really enjoy reading them! Thumbsup

Thank for your constant encouragement and your willingness to back me up to Maklelan even before you knew what I would say on my own behalf. It put a welcome smile on my face to see you agree with my experience.

It is my desire to be the voice of explanation that I wish I had access to when I was searching the internet for answers about my faith. I know I can't possibly be alone, since the internet is only becoming more commonplace as time passes. There must be others, like I was, who are looking for answers. Perhaps I can do them the favor of pioneering in some small way.

As far as this "progressive element" within the church, I find it shallow and deceptive. Picking and choosing one's beliefs from a doctrine that clearly says not to do that, is by definition, dishonest and ridiculous. I can attack them for the same reasons, and with the same arguments, as I attack religious moderation everywhere else.

Thanks again.

I couldn't agree more. A text that proclaims itself to be literal, an apointed prophet who 'holds the keys' to speak on christs behalf and a gang of apostles to parrot the dogma doesn't really leave a lot of room for personal interpretation. The Mormon church is the epitomy of fundamentalism. ... And yeah, I had your back! Big Grin

A man blames his bad childhood on leprechauns. He claims they don't exist, but yet still says without a doubt that they stole all his money and then killed his parents. That's why he became Leprechaun-Man

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21-01-2014, 11:20 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 05:00 PM)WitchSabrina Wrote:  there is such depth shared in DP's posts.

Thank you for this compliment. Sometimes I think I spend too much time on my posts, but after seeing you write this, I think I will continue to put effort into them. It means very much to me that you read and appreciate them. I will be sure not to disappoint, if I can.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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21-01-2014, 11:28 PM
RE: 10 Reasons Why I Rejected Mormonism, and So Should You
(21-01-2014 02:25 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  Plus...

the fact that taboos vary from culture to culture is very telling of them being man made.

Indeed, another acute point.

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