3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
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28-09-2011, 03:22 PM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
Intelligent design?.............................................................Video time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK3O6KYPm...re=related

LEARN DAM YOU! LEARN!

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28-09-2011, 03:30 PM
 
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
(28-09-2011 02:55 PM)fatihbarut Wrote:  So how many believers, who try to save you, you need to start your engines in your brain? It is obvious till now, including me are not successful.

A husband arriving home unexpectedly finds his wife in bed with another man. When he confronts her, she asks indignantly: “do you believe me or your eyes?”

Guess what reminded me of this joke? Big Grin
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28-09-2011, 03:32 PM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
zatamon....amazing. I should pay you to write stand up for me.

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28-09-2011, 04:49 PM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
(28-09-2011 02:55 PM)fatihbarut Wrote:  Eventhough evolution were the way of creation of God. There would still need an intelligent designer.
As I said before, when you can explain something logically it does not prove it wasn't created by an intelligence. Contrary it proves a Creator who has logic.
And as a believer I just can thank you that you lead me to understand Creator wisely via explaining how did he create.

This is not meant as an attack so I hope you don't take it as such: is English your first language? I ask because I'm having a difficult time following you at points. If English is your second language then I'll try to muddle through but if it's not, then please try to write a little clearer. Seriously, this is about the 3rd post I've struggled with and I'm trying to follow your points.

Anyway, onto your comments:

(28-09-2011 02:55 PM)fatihbarut Wrote:  Eventhough evolution were the way of creation of God. There would still need an intelligent designer.

Why? On what basis do you say that? What evidence do you provide? Evolutionary biologist can explain to you how evolution not only works but how the process of natural selection can account for all the variety of life on the Earth. They will not all agree on the "why" this happens, but they will all agree that it does happen and provide you with detailed explanations on what evolution is and how it works. None of those explanations requires a deity. And, if you were truly aware of some of the biological issues in nature, you would seriously question the idea of intelligence behind the design. Nature is filled with examples of what I'd call "unintelligent design". I suggest you read Richard Dawkins The Greatest Show on Earth. And, even if you chose not to, please provide some explanation and evidence as to why there would need to be an intelligent designer.

(28-09-2011 02:55 PM)fatihbarut Wrote:  As I said before, when you can explain something logically it does not prove it wasn't created by an intelligence. Contrary it proves a Creator who has logic.

I agree with your first statement. A logical explanation does not negate the possibility of a creator. I can provide you with a logical explanation of why an airplane can fly and the airplane has a creator. However, the fact that a logical explanation does not negate the possibility of a creator does not prove that it requires one. It does nothing of the sort. There is no proof at all, at least that I'm aware of, of a divine creator. If you have such proof, then please provide. But, "I'm here so there must be a god" is simply not an explanation.

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28-09-2011, 07:02 PM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
I'm done. I can't understand the poor grammar of the responses.

“Science is simply common sense at its best, that is, rigidly accurate in observation, and merciless to fallacy in logic.”
—Thomas Henry Huxley
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28-09-2011, 07:39 PM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
I've sat back and watched. This was funny... really only in the first post. Now because of a combination of terrible grammar which could be due to any number of things, and just brutal responses, I feel the need to beg and plead that the posts stop at this one.
C'mon Faith, it's silly isn't it? Don't start a thread with a header indicating active debate and then start a new one right away. If what you are trying to do is convert people this isn't the way at the best of times. These aren't the best of times, or at least this in't the best of places for that kind of tom foolery.

Clarity is key, and it helps if you aren't just talking out of your ass. Plus I think it would be nice to actually have you listen to our side before you make wild claims as if you know what we think like. Take a page from the book of Theo. I like Theo because he/she? is concise and fair, not to mention he/she usually tries to answer questions how it? knows how instead of just bulldozing into a new topic. I also like Theo for the strange reason of conviction. Theo is old school, not old enough I think to actually go out and stone people, but as far as I can reckon Theo believes we are all going to hell. Mostly. I don't even know where you stand and as such I have no idea how to actually debate with you, because as far as I know you're mental.

So... stop? maybe not, but at least try and be more well rounded.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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28-09-2011, 09:11 PM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
(28-09-2011 02:05 PM)fatihbarut Wrote:  I am sure at this point you want to take my attention to disasters, illnesses, death and other painful things on the earth.
Don't worry I will explain all of those in my message which I call it
"What is opinion about God! Merciful or Devastating"

Not: if I write anything wrong that is my ignorance, If I am rude that is lack of my humanity. I apologize for those. ( I am working on them)

OK, even my patience is thin here. Not because of what you say but because you are way in over your head here. This is not the place for your level of education... I'm sorry.

But there is one thing you MUST learn. Never EVER tell people what they are thinking. THAT it the highest form of arrogance. You are no more capable of knowing what we are thinking than a fly is. That is your biggest mistake this evening. And if that is representative of your god then you just gave me the biggest reason why NOT to believe.

You have much to learn before you can possibly enter this forum with any integrity. Excuse yourself from it before you throw more shame on your "god".

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29-09-2011, 04:39 AM (This post was last modified: 29-09-2011 05:27 AM by Filox.)
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
Since you are starting new threads all over the place, I will copy/paste all my answers and add new things to them in all your threads...

1- This is exactly why I have called you "optimist" when we first "talked". You, my friend, are an optimist, and a poor one.

First of all, you never told us WHAT is the God you believe in? What is your faith? We are talking here about your faith and your God, but you fail to say WHAT it is, so this discussion is pointless.

Next thing, you have no idea what you are saying, you are just "spreading the word of God" and fail to understand what that is. Others have said more than enough so I will not repeat it, but ask you to address some questions that were given to you, but you have ignored them ON PURPOSE!

Until these "few" things are done, don't bother writing here.

2 - In this thread you again didn't say WHAT and in WHO do you believe, But judging from what I have seen, I would go with Baha'i faith.

Then you have stated that we atheist are schizophrenics, but you got mad when we called you silly and stupid. My dear friend, you came here with completely wrong idea about who and what we are, so there is your problem, you are IGNORANT of the word atheism. I consider myself to very very moral person; I love my neighbors as I love myself, if not even more; I can not see other people suffering, it makes me sad and I will do what I can for them to help them; if I ever win a lottery, I would spend most of my money on helping other people, because I already have enough for myself to live a normal life, I would only get myself a new terrain vehicle for my pleasure; everything I do and the way I interact with my friends and family is the way Jesus "told us" to behave and live. There is only one small problem... I do not believe there was ever a person called Jesus, except those folks living in Acapulco.

What I wanted to say with this little story is that it is completely wrong for you or anyone else to think that if I (we) don't accept God and Jesus, that I cannot be a moral person, or that I am missing something in my life, that I have a hole to fill... You don't know me, you have no idea about me, you are just making STUPID and IGNORANT arguments and you are doing it not only wrong, but what you are saying is INSULTING and completely OPPOSITE of the truth.

You still refuse to answer the questions we are asking you, you still fail to provide any evidence or at least a nice philosophy for your claims.

Your grammar is terrible, but we can say that English is not your first language, so you are excused, but if it is, shame on you, go back to elementary school. You see, English is not my first language as well...

I will now go and read your third thread and put more of my thoughts there...

3- So this is your argument? We can not see God, so that is why we don't believe in him? I can't see air, wind, atoms, molecules, really clean glass window, really fast car, a fish deep in the sea, see bottom in a depth more that 10 meters and the list goes on, but this does not mean that these things don't exist, or that I don't believe in them. I don't believe in God because THERE IS NO GOD! You made it all up, your parents and priests and holly books have indoctrinated you from your youth and you have been brain washed, that is why you believe in God.

You say you "KNOW" HE(?!) exists. And you are wrong, you BELIEVE in him and you believe he exists, but you DO NOT KNOW that, because you have no evidence, you have never seen him, you never talked to him literally. Believing and knowing is a huge difference and you must learn the difference!

We here, we atheists, we try to think for ourselves, we try to understand things as we see and read about them, we explore, we learn, we evolve, we improve ourselves every day with new ideas and new knowledge. You and all the rest of religious people do not do this, you have your God and his Holly Book and that is all you need, so instantly you limit yourselves, you limit your knowledge and you limit your will to explore "outside" the box, that box being your religion. Nothing outside of your dogmas you will not even consider thinking about, and if you ever do, you start from religious view point, instead of taking neutral starting point and exploring without prejudice.

This "religion" limits you, it holds you back, I refuse to be told what to do because some MAN has written it in a book 2000 years ago. You say it is the word of God, but why and how do you expect me to believe you? Why? Who are you, so that I must take your word for it? Who told you it is the word of God, not the word of man, pretending to be a God? And don't tell me "you just know" this, no, you don't know it, you believe in it, but I do not wish to be blindly led around by people I don't know or trust, trust is something you need to earn, it is not given away lightly.

These are some of the reasons I don't believe in God, your or any other. I also love to read, explore and listen about biology, history, geography, I like to go live in the nature, sleep under a tree, watch how nature breathes around me... These things help me understand how it is all connected and how it all works together, how it was all "designed", but not by Super Best Friend, but by Nature and Universe itself. By the Laws of Physics, by the Laws of Nature and by the Laws of Universe.

In a strange way, you religious people are correct to assume there was "a creator", but you give it a wrong name and wrong description. You have mistaken God with normal, natural order of things, called the Universe...

Stop wasting your time, you are not saving anyone, nor we need salvation, you are the one that needs to start living your life, not someone else's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4nCQmO3st0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQeN21NTM...re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkSE2f3t7...re=related


Peace!

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29-09-2011, 05:02 AM
 
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
(28-09-2011 07:39 PM)lucradis Wrote:  So... stop? maybe not, but at least try and be more well rounded.

A priest comes upon this drunk who is pissing at a wall on a street in broad daylight.

The priest is furious: "How dare you, do it on a public street -- stop immediately!"

The drunk puts it away, zippes up his pants and starts laughing.

The priest yells at him again: "What are you laughing about!?"

The drunk says: "You think I stopped?"

Big Grin
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29-09-2011, 05:11 AM
RE: 3- "The invisibility of God" Really scientific matter to deny him?
Oh look, an argument with the premise that god is the default position. Lets hear what he has to say, it might be original and unbiased.

"We Humans are capable of greatness." -Carl Sagan
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