9/11: The Ultimate Con
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31-12-2011, 09:05 AM (This post was last modified: 31-12-2011 09:15 AM by NotSoVacuous.)
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
I am not saying that any of the conspiracies to date are true, nor am I saying they aren't. I will say it is funny how swiftly most of our ATHEIST forum members here aid to the defense of politicians who believe in magic... that coincides with the belief that all the nations that we are currently occupying because of 9/11 are out for our God-fearing allies, Israel.

Not saying they did it, but I am also not up in arms at roughly 99% against the idea that it was/is possible/probable.

The fervency skeptics show to conspirators is amazing giving the, not equal, but respectable probability that our own government quite possibly had a hand in this given their possibilities of interest: God and Israel.


And as for you dumbasses who believe it was a conspiracy, are you to really be taken seriously when making claims and no links/evidence to prove what you are saying? Links you idiots, LINKS.

No, documentaries =/= evidence.

"We Humans are capable of greatness." -Carl Sagan
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31-12-2011, 11:05 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(30-12-2011 02:18 AM)Filox Wrote:  Since it is so hard and demanding to do a professional demolition of buildings that size, how come that they collapsed perfectly, just like a demolition was taking place, how come not a single building around was even damaged? Some really crazy terrorists, precise to the max.

Tall buildings are designed and engineered to fall a certain way -especially in crowded cities like NYC - they have been engineered this way since the mid 50s. In earthquake prone areas, tall buildings are designed and engineered to move around and are often counterbalanced for stability -they too, will break apart and go down in a very particularly orchestrated way.
One of the upper floors of each WTC tall tower was devoted to a counter balance mechanism which manipulated all tower movement. Sheathed in aluminum-alloy, The World Trade Center towers used high-strength, load-bearing perimeter steel columns called Vierendeel trusses that were spaced closely together to form a strong, rigid wall structure, supporting virtually all lateral loads such as wind loads, and sharing the gravity load with the core columns. The engineering of these two buildings was quite ingenious, actually and used more aluminum than any buildings built at the time.

If ignited, aluminum combined with rust will produce a thermite reaction. Thermite burns at least 2500 degrees or more and can't be extinguished by any means -it burns so hot that it generally finally consumes itself. The reaction also produces smoke which is most often light or white, and can generate fountains of hot sparks.

I don't pay much attention to the conspiracy theories, so only know about some of the things that seem to stick out. I don't do any research about any of it. Things I know above, I knew before 9/11.

I also know that Minoru Yamasaki, the designer of the WTC Towers -the tallest buildings in the world- was terrified of heights.

Knowledge is one thing. How knowledge is used is entirely another.

I think in the end, I just feel like I'm a secular person who has a skeptical eye toward any extraordinary claim, carefully examining any extraordinary evidence before jumping to conclusions. ~ Eric ~ My friend ... who figured it out.
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06-01-2012, 11:10 PM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
I've always been against the conspiracy theory. Now I'm not so sure. After looking at a lot of the vids of experts, the evidence could go either way. Just depends on what experts you believe. I think one thing some use as a rule in all of this is something we can never know, and that is whether the people who COULD do it WOULD. I think most people just can't, or don't want to, believe that our own government, bank CEOs, Larry Silverstein, etc. would go so far as to take down those buildings for what boils down to money and power. Ultimately, it's what some are just comfortable believing. Similar to theism... One of the reasons I didn't believe in CT, is I just couldn't fathom my own government, or any American, being involved in such a heinous plot for personal gain. Because that's what we're talking about, isn't it? But with the way the bailouts are going, and the obscene amounts of money the CEOs are still making, I'm finding it easier to imagine what people like this are willing to do. And that's not even weighing the evidence. Truth is, if an expert, or several experts in a field lied to us, there's no way we would question them. I have no way of knowing what the buildings should have looked like had they not been intentionally brought down, assuming they were, or the opposite. Larry Silverstein admitted that building 7 was going to be brought down, so anyone arguing that is simply wrong to do so.



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12-01-2012, 09:18 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(31-12-2011 09:05 AM)NotSoVacuous Wrote:  I am not saying that any of the conspiracies to date are true, nor am I saying they aren't. I will say it is funny how swiftly most of our ATHEIST forum members here aid to the defense of politicians who believe in magic... that coincides with the belief that all the nations that we are currently occupying because of 9/11 are out for our God-fearing allies, Israel.

Not saying they did it, but I am also not up in arms at roughly 99% against the idea that it was/is possible/probable.

The fervency skeptics show to conspirators is amazing giving the, not equal, but respectable probability that our own government quite possibly had a hand in this given their possibilities of interest: God and Israel.


And as for you dumbasses who believe it was a conspiracy, are you to really be taken seriously when making claims and no links/evidence to prove what you are saying? Links you idiots, LINKS.

No, documentaries =/= evidence.

I also think it's funny that people who think that W was one of the most retarded politicians of all time could be involved in the largest and most complex conspiracy in history. One that also required involving as many as 10,000 other people and killing around 10,000 Americans between 9/11 and the wars. Do you really think there are as many as 10,000 individuals in this country with the brains to pull this off and that also could be so cold that they were okay with killing all those people?


Just lol'd at the thought of an army of diabolical geniuses.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

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12-01-2012, 10:11 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(12-01-2012 09:18 AM)germanyt Wrote:  
(31-12-2011 09:05 AM)NotSoVacuous Wrote:  I am not saying that any of the conspiracies to date are true, nor am I saying they aren't. I will say it is funny how swiftly most of our ATHEIST forum members here aid to the defense of politicians who believe in magic... that coincides with the belief that all the nations that we are currently occupying because of 9/11 are out for our God-fearing allies, Israel.

Not saying they did it, but I am also not up in arms at roughly 99% against the idea that it was/is possible/probable.

The fervency skeptics show to conspirators is amazing giving the, not equal, but respectable probability that our own government quite possibly had a hand in this given their possibilities of interest: God and Israel.


And as for you dumbasses who believe it was a conspiracy, are you to really be taken seriously when making claims and no links/evidence to prove what you are saying? Links you idiots, LINKS.

No, documentaries =/= evidence.

I also think it's funny that people who think that W was one of the most retarded politicians of all time could be involved in the largest and most complex conspiracy in history. One that also required involving as many as 10,000 other people and killing around 10,000 Americans between 9/11 and the wars. Do you really think there are as many as 10,000 individuals in this country with the brains to pull this off and that also could be so cold that they were okay with killing all those people?


Just lol'd at the thought of an army of diabolical geniuses.

Yes, the weakest spot in every conspiracy theory is the number of people who have to keep a secret.
That's what makes pretty much all of them ludicrous.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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02-02-2012, 09:05 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
hi i'm not from the U.S, and it seems the rest of the world has a very different view of 9/11 than the americans. not being so emotionally involved and spared from the mainstream media bombardment we can see the facts and evidences more objectively and rationally. the "official" version, the us gov version has more flaws, logical and pragmatical than the christian bible, rendering it completely unbelievable.
the most basic knowledge of engineering proves wrong most of the theory, and the most basic knowledge of military strategy and the history of the united states conflicts since the war with spain, dismantles the rest of it.
this forum and the entire page its suposedly dedicated to promote reason and free thinking. so apply this to the study of 9/11, dont be deceived anymore, because that lei has caused many many deaths and suffering all over the world.
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02-02-2012, 11:21 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(02-02-2012 09:05 AM)iluvatar77 Wrote:  hi i'm not from the U.S, and it seems the rest of the world has a very different view of 9/11 than the americans. not being so emotionally involved and spared from the mainstream media bombardment we can see the facts and evidences more objectively and rationally. the "official" version, the us gov version has more flaws, logical and pragmatical than the christian bible, rendering it completely unbelievable.
the most basic knowledge of engineering proves wrong most of the theory, and the most basic knowledge of military strategy and the history of the united states conflicts since the war with spain, dismantles the rest of it.
this forum and the entire page its suposedly dedicated to promote reason and free thinking. so apply this to the study of 9/11, dont be deceived anymore, because that lei has caused many many deaths and suffering all over the world.

The conspiracy theories have been pretty much debunked by actual engineers and scientists. It is clear that 19 maniacs flew hijacked airliners into the two towers, the Pentagon, and a field in Pennsylvania.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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03-02-2012, 01:35 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(02-02-2012 11:21 AM)Chas Wrote:  The conspiracy theories have been pretty much debunked by actual engineers and scientists. It is clear that 19 maniacs flew hijacked airliners into the two towers, the Pentagon, and a field in Pennsylvania.

Can you link the explanation of WTC7 being the only steel structured building in history to collapse from fire (I dont include the other two towers because of the structural damage caused by the planes hitting)

How are you actually sure that a "plane" hit the pentagon.....when the FBI/CIA removed all footage from cctv surrounding the area and still to this day refuse to give it back......that the only footage of what hit the pentagon is a grainy timelapse camera from a pentagon gatehouse (one of the most guarded places in the world with timelapse security cameras lol)

I wonder if any explanation can be given to how these hijackers learnt to fly small planes yet could manage to navigate and fly with such precision huge airliners???

What about the thousands of other Architects and engineers who are saying that what happened is bullshit......are we to only believe the "offical" story???

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03-02-2012, 06:30 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(03-02-2012 01:35 AM)bemore Wrote:  
(02-02-2012 11:21 AM)Chas Wrote:  The conspiracy theories have been pretty much debunked by actual engineers and scientists. It is clear that 19 maniacs flew hijacked airliners into the two towers, the Pentagon, and a field in Pennsylvania.

Can you link the explanation of WTC7 being the only steel structured building in history to collapse from fire (I dont include the other two towers because of the structural damage caused by the planes hitting)

Because WTC7 was hit by debris from the towers. There are pictures that show it.

Quote:How are you actually sure that a "plane" hit the pentagon.....when the FBI/CIA removed all footage from cctv surrounding the area and still to this day refuse to give it back......that the only footage of what hit the pentagon is a grainy timelapse camera from a pentagon gatehouse (one of the most guarded places in the world with timelapse security cameras lol)

This is just silly. So 2 planes hit the WTC towers, 1 crashed in Pennsylvania, but something else happened at the Pentagon on the same morning?

Quote:I wonder if any explanation can be given to how these hijackers learnt to fly small planes yet could manage to navigate and fly with such precision huge airliners???

What about the thousands of other Architects and engineers who are saying that what happened is bullshit......are we to only believe the "offical" story???

Flying an airliner in clear weather is easy. Taking-off, landing, severe weather, instrument-only flying are not easy.

There are very few professional architects or engineers who hold that opinion.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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03-02-2012, 07:02 AM
RE: 9/11: The Ultimate Con
(03-02-2012 06:30 AM)Chas Wrote:  Because WTC7 was hit by debris from the towers. There are pictures that show it.

So damage to the outside of the building that created a hole can cause a steel structured building to collapse at almost freefall speed???

Also I wonder how the BBC knew that the building had collapsed.....seeing as they actually said it had collapsed before it actually did.

(03-02-2012 06:30 AM)Chas Wrote:  This is just silly. So 2 planes hit the WTC towers, 1 crashed in Pennsylvania, but something else happened at the Pentagon on the same morning?

No....what I find silly is the fact that your rationally logical yet you put all of your faith into a few grainy pictures.......why else would the authorites remove every single scrap of evidence and refuse to give it back???

Also if you check old google maps you will see that the "crater" from the crashed/shot down plane was actually there years before the crash.....or maybe the plane crashed into the crater???

(03-02-2012 06:30 AM)Chas Wrote:  Flying an airliner in clear weather is easy. Taking-off, landing, severe weather, instrument-only flying are not easy.

There are very few professional architects or engineers who hold that opinion.

Well I think a lot of airline pilots will disagree with what you are saying with regards to flying the plane.

Also I think you will find there are thousands of different architects and engineers from all over the world who disagree with what has been said.

You're never going to say the things you want to say.
The things you want to change will usually stay that way
The promises you break outweigh the ones you keep.
Paint upon the wall for the hundredth time.

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