9,146 gun homicides in US. 16,885 killed by drunk drivers.
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20-01-2013, 10:26 PM
RE: 9,146 gun homicides in US. 16,885 killed by drunk drivers.
(20-01-2013 06:27 PM)TrulyX Wrote:  
(20-01-2013 11:57 AM)Chas Wrote:  Not my opinion - the Supreme Court's opinion is that it is an individual right.

I meant banning or limiting types of weapons. The Assault Weapons Ban is an example of ignorant legislation. Certain firearms were banned on purely cosmetic reasons.

The current majority of the Supreme Court; but I meant, that if you agreed with it, I would disagree with you.

I would agree with an "Assault Weapon Ban" being bad legislation. I would just say that it was more political.

Quote:If we are going to debate firearms, then there is a minimal level of firearms-related knowledge required to have a useful discussion.

I could see that, if you were debating details, but a general conversation about guns in society, in my opinion, would have an extremely low threshold for gun specific (technical) knowledge.

Quote:Do you not believe in a right to self-defense? Is it irrational for me to want to protect myself?
The purposes I listed are all legal and ethical purposes

Do I believe that if someone throws a punch at your face (just an example), you have the right to block? Not really. Define "right"? It would depend on that definition.

Do I believe that if a person is capable of blocking, there should be laws that punish that person for doing so? Absolutely not. If that is what you mean by right to defend yourself (or something similar), I believe it is something that should be allowed, without laws against it.

Quote:I maintain I have a right to self-defense. A firearm is the best tool for the job.

I hold the view that a gun (a weapon) is a tool for offense, not a defensive tool. A tool for self defense, might be a home alarm system, locks, bulletproof windows or vests, shields, helmets, etc.

Defense is what you do in response, as a reaction, to something, usually that someone else is doing, to prevent an intended goal. An example would be like a basketball player moving his feet to stay in front of an opponent to prevent an opponent from getting past them, or blocking the attempt at a shot, pass or dribble; things like shooting and looking for a pass, would be offensive.

Guns, to me, are offense all the way. Self defense, therefore, in my view, doesn't involve guns, because guns are offensive tools. Some people might say that the "best defense is a good offense", but I would have to point out, you're still taking about offense. You can't use the phrase "self defense" to make it sound lesser; that would be the exact same as a person using the term "assault weapon" to make it sound more.

Now, do I think that people should have protections, justification under law, a right if you will, to take offensive action against a person who first takes certain immoral actions against them first? And as most state laws outline this (some do it poorly), yes; however, a gun is not necessary (logically) for that, and I don't see it necessary (practically), to the point where it requires a right, dictated by the laws, of individuals to own them.

I do not understand your concept of right to defend oneself. No right to block a punch? WTAF?

Your other concepts of self-defense is completely unrealistic. How does a small or weak or disabled person defend against larger, stronger, or multiple assailants?

A helmet? You must be joking.

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RE: 9,146 gun homicides in US. 16,885 killed by drunk drivers. - Chas - 20-01-2013 10:26 PM
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