90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
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18-09-2014, 03:18 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 03:13 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(18-09-2014 03:11 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  At least Fred Phelps had actually done something to be a target of a protest. Unlike nearly all the victims of the WBC. So there's that.
I don't see how that is relevant to the issue of whether or not doing something you fervently condemn in others yourself makes you a hypocrite.

It's a matter of degrees. Posting a tweet laughing about someone getting done to them what they had been doing to you is not the height of virtue no but it is by no means on the same plane of existence that the death threats and other harassment doled out to Zoe Quinn were. Kind of how laughing at a video of a guy getting hit in the balls does not make a condemnation of violent rape hypocritical.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-09-2014, 03:28 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 03:18 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It's a matter of degrees. Posting a tweet laughing about someone getting done to them what they had been doing to you is not the height of virtue no but it is by no means on the same plane of existence that the death threats and other harassment doled out to Zoe Quinn.
As it happens, we agree on that.

(18-09-2014 03:18 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Kind of how laughing at a video of a guy getting hit in the balls does not make a condemnation of violent rape hypocritical.
Uh, yeah, that is... what? That's not a valid analogy.

A hypocrite is someone whose behavior does not conform to his or her (moral) beliefs. Zoe Quinn believes that harassment is wrong, yet she endorses it when it's aimed at her opposition. It couldn't be more clear-cut than that.

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18-09-2014, 03:31 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 03:28 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(18-09-2014 03:18 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  It's a matter of degrees. Posting a tweet laughing about someone getting done to them what they had been doing to you is not the height of virtue no but it is by no means on the same plane of existence that the death threats and other harassment doled out to Zoe Quinn.
As it happens, we agree on that.

(18-09-2014 03:18 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Kind of how laughing at a video of a guy getting hit in the balls does not make a condemnation of violent rape hypocritical.
Uh, yeah, that is... what? That's not a valid analogy.

A hypocrite is someone whose behavior does not conform to his or her (moral) beliefs. Zoe Quinn believes that harassment is wrong, yet she endorses it when it's aimed at her opposition. It couldn't be more clear-cut than that.

The analogy would be saying that the person is a hypocrite for condemning violence in the one case but not the other. It is intentional hyperbole to emphasis the point.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-09-2014, 03:38 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
I think it's about time we go back to the origin of this whole disagreement.

As per your OP, you believe that GamerGate is bullshit because it "fails all 4" standards provided by an article from a comedy website.

Do you still believe that after reading through the article I posted and after looking at the evidence that its author provided? If so, why? Please be as detailed as possible.

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18-09-2014, 03:51 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 03:38 PM)Vosur Wrote:  I think it's about time we go back to the origin of this whole disagreement.

As per your OP, you believe that GamerGate is bullshit because it "fails all 4" standards provided by an article from a comedy website.

Do you still believe that after reading through the article I posted and after looking at the evidence that its author provided? If so, why? Please be as detailed as possible.

Ok point 1 still fails "Question 1: Does Your Cause Require an Elaborate Conspiracy Theory to Be True?"

Point 2 "Question 2: Does Your Cause Apply Only When It's Convenient?" Oh dear FSM yes to this one. I can give you other examples where a woman got a disordinant amount of harassment for a similar incident as a man. We tend to have this discussion about gaming every 15 months or so.

http://www.cracked.com/blog/4-ways-gamer...ith-women/

Several are highlighted there.

Point 3 "Question 3: Have You Ever Experienced a Real-World Example of Your Cause?" I've heard accusations but it is usually given by the loser who no one really likes anyway since they suck at their job. So this one is kind of a toss up.

Point 4 "Question 4: Is Your "Oppressed" Group Literally in Charge of the Media and Government?" Ahahahahahahahahaha White Male check check and double check.

So out of all 4 I will admit #3 is not a slam dunk but the other 3 yeah they fit this to a T.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-09-2014, 04:01 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 03:51 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(18-09-2014 03:38 PM)Vosur Wrote:  I think it's about time we go back to the origin of this whole disagreement.

As per your OP, you believe that GamerGate is bullshit because it "fails all 4" standards provided by an article from a comedy website.

Do you still believe that after reading through the article I posted and after looking at the evidence that its author provided? If so, why? Please be as detailed as possible.

Ok point 1 still fails "Question 1: Does Your Cause Require an Elaborate Conspiracy Theory to Be True?"

Point 2 "Question 2: Does Your Cause Apply Only When It's Convenient?" Oh dear FSM yes to this one. I can give you other examples where a woman got a disordinant amount of harassment for a similar incident as a man. We tend to have this discussion about gaming every 15 months or so.

http://www.cracked.com/blog/4-ways-gamer...ith-women/

Several are highlighted there.

Point 3 "Question 3: Have You Ever Experienced a Real-World Example of Your Cause?" I've heard accusations but it is usually given by the loser who no one really likes anyway since they suck at their job. So this one is kind of a toss up.

Point 4 "Question 4: Is Your "Oppressed" Group Literally in Charge of the Media and Government?" Ahahahahahahahahaha White Male check check and double check.

So out of all 4 I will admit #3 is not a slam dunk but the other 3 yeah they fit this to a T.
I'm sorry, I suppose I should have been a bit clearer with my wording. When I said "Please be as detailed as possible," I meant something along the lines of the following:

"Question 1: Does Your Cause Require an Elaborate Conspiracy Theory to Be True?
Yes, because the article you posted claims that person A, B and C are conspiring to accomplish purpose X."

In other words, I was looking for a response that evaluates these questions using the source I provided. It's hard to argue against your points when I don't know whose views you are referencing.

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18-09-2014, 04:16 PM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 04:01 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(18-09-2014 03:51 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Ok point 1 still fails "Question 1: Does Your Cause Require an Elaborate Conspiracy Theory to Be True?"

Point 2 "Question 2: Does Your Cause Apply Only When It's Convenient?" Oh dear FSM yes to this one. I can give you other examples where a woman got a disordinant amount of harassment for a similar incident as a man. We tend to have this discussion about gaming every 15 months or so.

http://www.cracked.com/blog/4-ways-gamer...ith-women/

Several are highlighted there.

Point 3 "Question 3: Have You Ever Experienced a Real-World Example of Your Cause?" I've heard accusations but it is usually given by the loser who no one really likes anyway since they suck at their job. So this one is kind of a toss up.

Point 4 "Question 4: Is Your "Oppressed" Group Literally in Charge of the Media and Government?" Ahahahahahahahahaha White Male check check and double check.

So out of all 4 I will admit #3 is not a slam dunk but the other 3 yeah they fit this to a T.
I'm sorry, I suppose I should have been a bit clearer with my wording. When I said "Please be as detailed as possible," I meant something along the lines of the following:

"Question 1: Does Your Cause Require an Elaborate Conspiracy Theory to Be True?
Yes, because the article you posted claims that person A, B and C are conspiring to accomplish purpose X."

In other words, I was looking for a response that evaluates these questions using the source I provided. It's hard to argue against your points when I don't know whose views you are referencing.

Considering the entire basis of the opinion piece you posted was that there really was a conspiracy and it's not just mindless misogyny fueling the #Gamergate scandal. The accused false indiscretions of Zoe Quinn is a drop of water next to the ocean compared to the much larger issue with women in gaming that the response uncovered. So when anyone not in the 4chan universe attempted to shift the topic to one that is far more worthy of a discussion they were accused of collusion and being extreme SJW's (always beware anyone that uses that buzzword) so yes it still fails the conspiracy charge.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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19-09-2014, 12:45 AM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(18-09-2014 04:16 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Considering the entire basis of the opinion piece you posted was that there really was a conspiracy and it's not just mindless misogyny fueling the #Gamergate scandal. The accused false indiscretions of Zoe Quinn is a drop of water next to the ocean compared to the much larger issue with women in gaming that the response uncovered. So when anyone not in the 4chan universe attempted to shift the topic to one that is far more worthy of a discussion they were accused of collusion and being extreme SJW's (always beware anyone that uses that buzzword) so yes it still fails the conspiracy charge.
Where are you getting that idea from? The word "conspiracy" isn't used a single time in the entire article.

I'm a moderator, Revenant. Do you think you would be fine if I abused my power and started deleting the posts of everyone who argued against me here? No? Why, then, do you "not care" that the opposition of GamerGate does it?

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19-09-2014, 01:43 AM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(19-09-2014 12:45 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(18-09-2014 04:16 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Considering the entire basis of the opinion piece you posted was that there really was a conspiracy and it's not just mindless misogyny fueling the #Gamergate scandal. The accused false indiscretions of Zoe Quinn is a drop of water next to the ocean compared to the much larger issue with women in gaming that the response uncovered. So when anyone not in the 4chan universe attempted to shift the topic to one that is far more worthy of a discussion they were accused of collusion and being extreme SJW's (always beware anyone that uses that buzzword) so yes it still fails the conspiracy charge.
Where are you getting that idea from? The word "conspiracy" isn't used a single time in the entire article.

I'm a moderator, Revenant. Do you think you would be fine if I abused my power and started deleting the posts of everyone who argued against me here? No? Why, then, do you "not care" that the opposition of GamerGate does it?

If you were deleting death threats and postings of personal information such as home addresses then yes you should be deleting those posts.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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19-09-2014, 01:46 AM
RE: 90 second guide to Determine if Your Internet Cause Is BS
(19-09-2014 01:43 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  If you were deleting death threats and postings of personal information such as home addresses then yes you should be deleting those posts.
And what if I was deleting any and all criticism aimed against me? What would you think about that? Because that's what has happened and keeps happening on 4chan and reddit.

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