A Spiritual Atheist Looking For Philosophers
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30-08-2014, 05:08 PM
RE: A Spiritual Atheist Looking For Philosophers
(27-08-2014 05:15 AM)Garyplumley Wrote:  Gary Plumley • 23 minutes ago




I had a near death experience (NDE) and my story is being rejected by religions and even the NDE community. I think I have a better chance offering my story to an open minded atheist. I am not religious but my story talks a lot about the bible and how it is very much miss-interpreted. My experience is real but it's not your typical, going thru a tunnel, seeing a bright light meeting up with Jesus, etc. I have some pieces of the puzzle in my story but people seem to want to keep the knowledge of the afterlife a mystery. Anyone dare to read my story and give me feedback?? I love feedback pos. and neg. You can find my story at: http://nhneneardeath.ning.com/...
In my story I dare to try to explain knowledge I was uploaded with when I was dead. No other NDEer tries to do that. It makes me look arrogant.

Your link doesnt work.
I am interested in NDE's and OBE's and would like to discuss further.

My own experience is with some OBE's (out of body experiences) and particularly lucid dreaming. I used to be orthodox religious and then deeply into new age spirituality and these experiences I had add a high degree of credentials within such "spiritual & orthodox" practices.

However - now I consider myself a philosopher within a generally naturalistic framework. I am absolutely convinced of atheism to any personal type deities however potentially agnostic to pantheism (version such as spinozism)

I think one can have a "spiritual" atheism but the problem is the word spiritual is heavily loaded with all sorts of heavy baggage, woo, pseudo-science & poor philosophy & religious associations which lack evidence.

Interestingly I read a book recently called:
unSpirituality: Permission to Be Human (Unabridged) by Christopher Loren
This had some interesting insights into the dangers of "spirituality" which are often not considered - to put it frankly accepting the fact we are animals and need to accept the "positive & negative" that goes with that.
'spirituality' often ends up with people living a dichotomy denying the negative so called 'physical' aspects of out lives in the hope of achieving some superior transcendent state of mind - and sometimes this comes at the peril of ignoring embodied experience as the default true nature of the human condition. (i.e not some separable 'mind' and 'physical body')

...but saying that I have personally experienced benefits of 'mindful meditation' and some 'spiritual practices' can be very beneficial. I would go along the lines of the stoic philosophers who were in search for 'the good life' but without the need for a God hypothesis to provide that.

In fact, in my experience the God hypothesis is detrimental to 'the good life' - usually leading to various types of escapism and pseudo-explanations to justify what cannot be explained or what can be explained but we don't like the answers we get from science or philosophical analysis.
An example related to your thread:
"ID & intelligent design"
The God hypothesis justifies 'bad design' (congenital deformities, various diseases like malaria etc) within the natural world to concepts such as original sin, sin in general, 'free will' allowing extreme suffering, Satan/devil/fallen angels, reincarnation for bad karma or a whole host of other explanations knows as 'theodicy'
- all the above presuppose God is a good designer but out of necessity had to allow 'bad design' within the natural world.

The naturalistic explanation are far more straightforward with no ad-hoc reasoning or pseudo-explanations. Basically evolution is a bitch of an impersonal process, doesn't give a shit about you, what appears to be designed has been refined over millions of years because it works and the stuff that doesn't work either doesn't have selection pressure for complete removal or gets eliminated. Bingo. Eg: Huntington's disease carries on because the devastating effects occur AFTER the carriers have reproduced with enough time to begin looking after offspring to ensure their survival and then die from a crippling, devastating, horrifying torturous brain wasting disease - but little selection pressure to eliminate the genes involved.
Something like Huntington's disease just cannot be explained via ID or a personal God without sounding ridiculous (or an impersonal irrelevant God such as within Deism)

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence -
David Hume


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