A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
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18-06-2014, 02:55 PM
RE: A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
(18-06-2014 02:44 PM)Anna Wrote:  
(18-06-2014 02:30 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Anna - when was the universe ever nothing ?

At what point back in time does everything simply disappear ?

Isn't the concept of time man-made? It's hard to even mentally go so further back in time when the universe stops existing.
I don't really know. I tried believing that the universe was always there, but it didn't work too well because I have no evidence to support it and if I was going to accept something without evidence I might as well just accept God.

Well this is where space-time gets all wibbly wobbly timey wimey. Before the Big Bang we don't know what there was because Space-time did not exist yet or at least not in it's present form.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-06-2014, 02:59 PM
RE: A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
(18-06-2014 02:55 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(18-06-2014 02:44 PM)Anna Wrote:  Isn't the concept of time man-made? It's hard to even mentally go so further back in time when the universe stops existing.
I don't really know. I tried believing that the universe was always there, but it didn't work too well because I have no evidence to support it and if I was going to accept something without evidence I might as well just accept God.

Well this is where space-time gets all wibbly wobbly timey wimey. Before the Big Bang we don't know what there was because Space-time did not exist yet or at least not in it's present form.

Yes and we do know that if we did go in past far back enough to the big bang, the temperature would be so high that matter could not have existed, only energy. So I think its safe to say that the universe did have a beginning.

All great truths begin as blasphemy - George Bernard Shaw
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18-06-2014, 03:00 PM
RE: A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
(18-06-2014 02:44 PM)Anna Wrote:  
(18-06-2014 02:30 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Anna - when was the universe ever nothing ?

At what point back in time does everything simply disappear ?

Isn't the concept of time man-made? It's hard to even mentally go so further back in time when the universe stops existing.
I don't really know. I tried believing that the universe was always there, but it didn't work too well because I have no evidence to support it and if I was going to accept something without evidence I might as well just accept God.

The way I understand it is that time is the unfolding or occurrence of events; while humanity's measurements are the product of arbitrary human creation, time in and of itself is distinct from human perception as things still happen with or without human perception.

Time, just like space, began existing when the Singularity erupted, creating this universe's first event. However, due to how time works, all our current understandings of it break down at that point and doesn't work at all prior.

Or so I'm told; I'm not physicist, so I may well be misinformed.

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18-06-2014, 03:08 PM
RE: A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
(18-06-2014 03:00 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(18-06-2014 02:44 PM)Anna Wrote:  Isn't the concept of time man-made? It's hard to even mentally go so further back in time when the universe stops existing.
I don't really know. I tried believing that the universe was always there, but it didn't work too well because I have no evidence to support it and if I was going to accept something without evidence I might as well just accept God.

The way I understand it is that time is the unfolding or occurrence of events; while humanity's measurements are the product of arbitrary human creation, time in and of itself is distinct from human perception as things still happen with or without human perception.

Time, just like space, began existing when the Singularity erupted, creating this universe's first event. However, due to how time works, all our current understandings of it break down at that point and doesn't work at all prior.

Or so I'm told; I'm not physicist, so I may well be misinformed.

Exactly, we can't go 'before' the big bang because we don't even know if it would apply in those circumstances. If we consider a large black space with absolutely nothing in it then it wouldn't make any difference how much time has passed because everything (or more correctly 'nothing') would be still, nothing moving forward or backward.

All great truths begin as blasphemy - George Bernard Shaw
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18-06-2014, 03:12 PM
RE: A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
(18-06-2014 02:59 PM)Anna Wrote:  
(18-06-2014 02:55 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Well this is where space-time gets all wibbly wobbly timey wimey. Before the Big Bang we don't know what there was because Space-time did not exist yet or at least not in it's present form.

Yes and we do know that if we did go in past far back enough to the big bang, the temperature would be so high that matter could not have existed, only energy. So I think its safe to say that the universe did have a beginning.

In it's present form yes. What came before is unknown it could be cyclical "Big Bang leads to Big Crunch Leads to Big Bang..." or it could be a one off "Big Bang leads to Big Chill" as of right now we do not know.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-06-2014, 03:28 PM
RE: A Universe from nothing and Qur'an
(18-06-2014 03:12 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(18-06-2014 02:59 PM)Anna Wrote:  Yes and we do know that if we did go in past far back enough to the big bang, the temperature would be so high that matter could not have existed, only energy. So I think its safe to say that the universe did have a beginning.

In it's present form yes. What came before is unknown it could be cyclical "Big Bang leads to Big Crunch Leads to Big Bang..." or it could be a one off "Big Bang leads to Big Chill" as of right now we do not know.

Thanks I like the idea of cyclical big bang much better Big Grin

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