A crime is all I can think of...
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03-10-2011, 11:31 AM
A crime is all I can think of...
This man had books, videos, and ground breaking discoveries. It should be a fucking crime that I was never taught of him in my science classes.

"We Humans are capable of greatness." -Carl Sagan
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03-10-2011, 10:51 PM
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
Carl Sagan was the Gandhi of science. I can't think of anyone I would more want to be god than him. I loved that man. Still do.

Who can turn skies back and begin again?
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11-10-2011, 01:48 PM
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
There is an amazing series of remade (I know! It's horrible, but bear with me =P) Carl Sagan clips, under the title of 'The Sagan Series' on YouTube.

"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason and intellect has intended us to forego their use." - Galileo

"Every man is guilty of all the good he did not do." - Voltaire
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11-10-2011, 03:53 PM
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
I just have to respond to this.

Carl Sagan is one of my heroes.

In the book I am writing on science, there is a chapter called:

Carl Sagan’s Dream

We are so used to nightmares like wars, famine, threats of extinction (thousands of nuclear warheads on hair-trigger alert) that we forget about the good dreams that occasionally surprise us.

Ironically, sometimes good dreams come true because someone, somewhere, in position of power, decides to co-opt someone’s dream and turn it into some kind of a weapon. That is how the Russian and American space programs started back in the 1960-s. They wanted to impress each other with their ‘superior’ technology and they were already considering the ‘advantages’ of a militarized space.

However, there were real dreamers behind the success story: dreamers who thought beyond the predictable certainty of more of the same and decided that great accomplishments, giant steps forward, were also possible for mankind. After all, where is it written that only nightmares are possible, only stupidity, violence and depravity could be expected from our species.

Carl Sagan was one of these dreamers and he gambled big on the possibility of it coming true. He could have become a Nobel-prized scientist, making huge steps forward in Physics, Astronomy, even Biology, if he wanted to play it safe and follow the accepted and established route to academic success. He had everything needed for this feat: brilliance, education, energy, passion, charm.

He didn’t choose this route because he was born to be, perhaps the last of his kind, a renaissance scientist with a universal interest, a passion for ‘big picture’ meanings and an overwhelming desire to be part of something bigger than himself.

Carl Sagan dreamed about the stars. Not the lifeless, infinite cosmos that frightens those who let themselves really feel it, but a cosmos teaming with life, intelligence and countless number of advanced species who have already solved their primitive evolutionary problems of domination and competition.

In his science fiction book “Contact”, when the heroin Elly is about to leave in an inter-galactic transport to meet one of these superior species, she is asked: “if you could ask them only one question, what would it be?” – Her answer was: “how did you do it? How did you survive your technological adolescence before you evolved beyond the danger of self-destruction?”

Carl Sagan dreamed all his life about the possibility that such a meeting, one day, might be possible. He did everything his brilliance, energy and passion enabled him to do to find this opportunity, to be ready for it if and when it happened. He contributed substantially to Planetary Science, to research in ‘origin of life’ studies, to the planning of space missions to our planets and beyond.

He wrote books on the meaning of science, human evolution and the dangers of irrational thinking and pseudo-scientific trends. He popularized science to the masses and projected an image of human greatness in discovery, rather than conquest. He fought the establishment in their mad rush toward nuclear annihilation by pointing out the dangers of ‘nuclear winter’ that might follow even a limited atomic war.

He died relatively young, in 1996, when a real possibility of nuclear disarmament and international cooperation seemed at hand. He thought that after half a century of cold war madness it was time for dreaming and hoping again. He would be very sad and very angry now, a decade and a half after his death.

His main theme, all through his life had been: “what if?” and “why not?”

What if it were possible to live in peace? What if it were possible to escape from our planetary prison and establish human roots on other planets, orbiting other stars? What if one day we could wake up from our nightmare of primitive savagery and learn ‘just’ to live and experience all the marvels of the universe?

This “what if?” attitude may seem naïve and impractical for many ‘serious’ people who forget that telephone, radio, TV, airplanes, computers were all “what if?” dreams of impractical dreamers at one time or another.

This dream is still just a dream of idealistic and ‘impractical’ Star Trek fans around the globe. Even though Carl Sagan did not like Star Trek, because he judged it scientifically inaccurate, but it still represents, in a symbolic way, the possibility of human greatness and cooperation for millions around the globe.

Most Star Trek fans remember Captain Picard’s speech to a group of earthmen from the 20-th century, who were found and thawed out from suspended animation, about how money had no meaning in the 24-th century, and the only challenge was realizing one’s creative potential. This assumption of peace, cooperation, creative drive of a unified humanity is central in the Star Trek Saga and coincides with the dreams of billions on this planet. The reward of this fulfilled dream would be the marvels of the Galaxy suddenly open and available for us.

Let me repeat: why is it taken for granted that only nightmares are possible in the human saga? To quote from "Lucifer’s Hammer" by Larry Niven: "Dreams sometimes come true, even if you tell them”.
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14-10-2011, 09:25 PM
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
i remember watching pale blue planet, faved it. really makes u think

"In real life , as opposed to that happy, clappy, rainbow fantasy world that you see fit to fly through on your winged unicorn of delusion" - Mitchell and Webb
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14-10-2011, 10:27 PM
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
How can you make a theist watch this with an open mind? Better yet, how can anyone who watches this with an open mind still be a theist?


Keep living your life. It's the only one you have.
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14-10-2011, 11:35 PM
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
I've always wondered... how many people would have never picked up a science book or simply went outside and looked at the stars, had it not been for Dr Sagan? Zatemon is right... Carl was indeed, a dreamer. Heart

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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15-10-2011, 03:04 PM (This post was last modified: 15-10-2011 03:10 PM by Peterkin.)
RE: A crime is all I can think of...
I watched Cosmos when it came out, one week at a time, with interminable waits in between. That's what prompted me, eventually, to subscribe to Omni magazine, which then turned me off scienetism. Go figure!
You can get it - Cosmos, i mean, not omni - probably remastered, on dvd, and should; it's beautiful.

If you pray to anything, you're prey to anything.
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