A few thoughts
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29-01-2015, 10:38 AM
A few thoughts
  • If I spent as much time on Christian web sites as I do on The Thinking Atheist, I'd be a religious nut. So am I an atheist nut?
  • The Argument from Personal Incredulity is a fallacy, yet this is the primary reason I am an atheist. I just can't bring myself to believe that "God did it" is the correct answer.
  • Maybe I'm closed minded. When listening to a new argument from a theist (are there any new arguments from theists?) I find myself looking for holes in his logic before he has finished.
  • Isn't the difference between an agnostic and an atheist pure semantics? Even Dawkins does not claim to be a 7.
  • There was a running gag in the Sunday comics back in the 1950s where a vacuum cleaner sales man came to you house, dumped a bag of dirt on your floor and then cleaned it up with his product. The joke consisted of his inevitably making a mess that he could not clean up. Isn't this what Christians do? They bring a bag of sin into your life then claim that their religion can fix it. But I did not have a problem before they showed up.

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29-01-2015, 10:53 AM
RE: A few thoughts
Um no. Being around educated people, and seeing other atheists arguments allows you to learn from others. And considering that religious people run governments worldwide and control weapons I think it is perfectly reasonable to compare notes in order to combat religious attempts at theocracy and to keep it off a pedestal. I'd say it is worse, even with politics to ignore the world around you. It is like leaving a campfire unattended.

It does not make you a nut to want to hang out with like minded people. You are not nuts for challenging claims or ridiculing claims for that matter. Nuts is when ANYONE tries to set up special privilege to the point of blasphemy laws and or oppressive laws that force silence on others or subjugate others to second class or sub human status.

If you live in a part of the world where you are not being arrested for what you say, or being arrested for offending others, and you get to go to bed at night without fear of mob justice, or state fascism, then you are not being oppressed nor is offending others oppressing them.

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29-01-2015, 11:06 AM
RE: A few thoughts
Some points:

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  ]If I spent as much time on Christian web sites as I do on The Thinking Atheist, I'd be a religious nut. So am I an atheist nut?

Being a nut is not directly related to the time you spend on a forum. I used to spend time on forums about Hip-Hop... Was I a nut in that regard? I don't see the logic.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  The Argument from Personal Incredulity is a fallacy, yet this is the primary reason I am an atheist. I just can't bring myself to believe that "God did it" is the correct answer.

It's the first time I hear of this fallacy. Maybe someone that has known it from before can help better, I have still to understand how it works and where it can be applied.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  Maybe I'm closed minded. When listening to a new argument from a theist (are there any new arguments from theists?) I find myself looking for holes in his logic before he has finished.

That's not wrong. In fact, it's what you're supposed to do in every field, you should do that with everyone. If the argument has merits and can stand on its own, you won't find holes in it, and the flaws will be minimal and not critical.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  Isn't the difference between an agnostic and an atheist pure semantics? Even Dawkins does not claim to be a 7.

Shh! Please don't start that here too! ¬_¬ lol

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29-01-2015, 11:20 AM
RE: A few thoughts
(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  If I spent as much time on Christian web sites as I do on The Thinking Atheist, I'd be a religious nut. So am I an atheist nut?

That depends on why you are spending so much time here. Religious nuts are looking to reinforce their beliefs. Are you looking only for that?

I don't think spending time on a site makes you a nut; I think being a nut can make you spend time on a site.

Quote:The Argument from Personal Incredulity is a fallacy, yet this is the primary reason I am an atheist. I just can't bring myself to believe that "God did it" is the correct answer.

The argument from incredulity jumps to god because you can't or won't accept the evidence being presented. If you were provided any actual evidence that is best explained by the existence of a god would you reject it out of hand?

Quote:Maybe I'm closed minded. When listening to a new argument from a theist (are there any new arguments from theists?) I find myself looking for holes in his logic before he has finished.

As TPA said, that's just being a skeptic. That's what I at least try to do with all arguments on all subjects. It isn't being closed-minded unless you reject evidence that leads you towards a conclusion you dislike.

Quote:Isn't the difference between an agnostic and an atheist pure semantics? Even Dawkins does not claim to be a 7.

Mostly. It's very tiring. Call yourself whatever the hell you want to as long as you can agree on terms for the purpose of specific conversations.

Quote:There was a running gag in the Sunday comics back in the 1950s where a vacuum cleaner sales man came to you house, dumped a bag of dirt on your floor and then cleaned it up with his product. The joke consisted of his inevitably making a mess that he could not clean up. Isn't this what Christians do? They bring a bag of sin into your life then claim that their religion can fix it. But I did not have a problem before they showed up.

Yep, they create an imaginary problem and then provide an imaginary solution but all for a real cost.

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29-01-2015, 11:24 AM
RE: A few thoughts
(29-01-2015 11:06 AM)The Polyglot Atheist Wrote:  
(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  The Argument from Personal Incredulity is a fallacy, yet this is the primary reason I am an atheist. I just can't bring myself to believe that "God did it" is the correct answer.

It's the first time I hear of this fallacy. Maybe someone that has known it from before can help better, I have still to understand how it works and where it can be applied.

Dawkins refers to this often when dealing with people who don't accept evolution because they don't see how the eye could have evolved, for example. "It seems implausible to me, therefore it couldn't have happened" -- this is the argument from personal incredulity.

In a sense, atheists who insist God doesn't exist because his existence seems implausible would be guilty of the same fallacy. Except that there is far more evidence for evolution than there is for God. Nevertheless, this is one of the reasons why I am only an agnostic atheist (rather than a "strong" or "gnostic" one). I don't believe God exists, but I can't prove his nonexistence, and I'm not about to claim that I can. I admit the possibility that God exists, but I withhold belief unless and until good evidence is presented.
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29-01-2015, 05:26 PM
RE: A few thoughts
^^^Yabut there's incredulity through ignorance and evidence-based incredulity.

"I don't mind being wrong...it's a time I get to learn something new..."
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N.B: I routinely make edits to posts to correct grammar or spelling, or to restate a point more clearly. I only notify edits if they materially change meaning.
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30-01-2015, 05:00 AM
RE: A few thoughts
Yeah gofish!, I think that's the difference, the evidence vs the rejection of it.

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30-01-2015, 04:16 PM (This post was last modified: 30-01-2015 06:36 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: A few thoughts
(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  [*]If I spent as much time on Christian web sites as I do on The Thinking Atheist, I'd be a religious nut. So am I an atheist nut?

I'm only here for the pussy.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  [*]The Argument from Personal Incredulity is a fallacy, yet this is the primary reason I am an atheist.

Who else you gonna call? One of the nutjobs around here keeps asking "Who is your ultimate authority?" I keep telling him I AM. He don't get it. 'Cause he's a nutjob and shit.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  [*]Maybe I'm closed minded. When listening to a new argument from a theist (are there any new arguments from theists?) I find myself looking for holes in his logic before he has finished.

I do the opposite. I play Devil's Advocate to try and see how could I make their argument stronger. They all end up reducing to dualism and get thrown on the compost pile.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  [*]Isn't the difference between an agnostic and an atheist pure semantics? Even Dawkins does not claim to be a 7.

All this talk of gods and shit is premature. I'm a pretheist. Worry about yourself first.

(29-01-2015 10:38 AM)f stop Wrote:  [*]There was a running gag in the Sunday comics back in the 1950s where a vacuum cleaner sales man came to you house, dumped a bag of dirt on your floor and then cleaned it up with his product. The joke consisted of his inevitably making a mess that he could not clean up. Isn't this what Christians do? They bring a bag of sin into your life then claim that their religion can fix it. But I did not have a problem before they showed up.

Monkeys flinging poo. Of course I was the one who decided to visit the zoo so I can hardly blame the monkeys for their expression of their gratitude. Big Grin




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30-01-2015, 06:27 PM
RE: A few thoughts
Quote:But I did not have a problem before they showed up.

That's because you're a dirty atheist who hates God.
You hide it all away deep down, out of sight, out of mind. Christians just bring it to light and remind you of how shitty a person you are so that you may confront the problem head on and not just bury it deep down.

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