A "gotcha" argument for Satan
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02-03-2015, 03:37 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 09:54 AM)claywise Wrote:  I hate this tack by Christians:

The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

But in a way, it represents a classic mode of "argument" they like to use: The fact that we cannot/do not see something or evidence for something is powerful confirmation that it exists.

In other words, the fact that there is no evidence of a devil should frighten you into accepting that there is a devil.

I don't think it was "his greatest trick". When you see a derelict wino drinking scotch in the street, you can see sin. When you see a powerful, wealthy, charismatic theist preaching good works but who doesn't know Jesus from a whole in the head being popular in this world, you are seeing a "great trick".

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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02-03-2015, 04:48 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 02:44 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(02-03-2015 02:34 PM)claywise Wrote:  Yes, that was all about an ego-boost for me and my magnificent mind.

I am almost certainly not one of the "chosen" (whether defined by Judaism, good ol' Calvin, or some king or other), since try as I might—even after living most of my life as a Christian—I simply can't force myself to believe.

How about a rephrase to spare anyone's delicate sensibilities:

I can only speak for myself, but when science has proved to my satisfaction—and, implicitly or explicitly, that of anyone who uses technology and applied science—time and again, that evidence is a good standard for what I believe, I just can't get my head around the idea that lack of evidence is good evidence.

No. Not sensitive.

You just sound like a colossal wank because you can't understand how people can think differently than you.

Faith is not thinking.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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02-03-2015, 05:06 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
If Satan is in hell, how is he doing anything at all ?

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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02-03-2015, 05:12 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
Anybody else stop reading a thread once Q has entered? I like hearing opposing viewpoints, but have yet to learn anything from his shtick
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02-03-2015, 05:13 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 05:06 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  If Satan is in hell, how is he doing anything at all ?

Apparently he commutes to work....


...

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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02-03-2015, 06:25 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 05:06 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  If Satan is in hell, how is he doing anything at all ?

Apparently god calls him up to heaven on poker night when he feels like betting on people's lives or betting how to do a bad human design:




Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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02-03-2015, 06:25 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 02:44 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  You just sound like a colossal wank because you can't understand how people can think differently than you.

Hmmm. And here I thought my second try specifically avoided saying anything like that. You know "I statements" and so forth; and that does express how I feel.

Wank or not, the work I've done for most my life actually puts me in the specific position of listening to different points of view and trying to be, if not objective (don't think I believe in that), then at least balanced. Not only do I understand how people can—and do—think differently than I do, I make it a point to take their thinking seriously. I don't even assume I'm correct, as I think my gradual transformation from believer to atheist shows.

But glad you are "chosen." I definitely am not.

God does not work in mysterious ways — he works in ways that are indistinguishable from his non-existence.
Jesus had a pretty rough weekend for your sins.
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02-03-2015, 06:28 PM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 05:12 PM)freetoreason Wrote:  Anybody else stop reading a thread once Q has entered? I like hearing opposing viewpoints, but have yet to learn anything from his shtick

I learned just yesterday that there is an "ignore" button, and that's where Q lives on my continuum.

God does not work in mysterious ways — he works in ways that are indistinguishable from his non-existence.
Jesus had a pretty rough weekend for your sins.
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02-03-2015, 06:35 PM (This post was last modified: 02-03-2015 06:45 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 09:54 AM)claywise Wrote:  I hate this tack by Christians:

The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

But in a way, it represents a classic mode of "argument" they like to use: The fact that we cannot/do not see something or evidence for something is powerful confirmation that it exists.

In other words, the fact that there is no evidence of a devil should frighten you into accepting that there is a devil.

When some generic Christian makes this argument it don't bother me at all 'cause I expect nonsense. But it scares the shit out of me when a Supreme Court Justice makes it.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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03-03-2015, 08:29 AM
RE: A "gotcha" argument for Satan
(02-03-2015 06:25 PM)claywise Wrote:  Hmmm. And here I thought my second try specifically avoided saying anything like that. You know "I statements" and so forth; and that does express how I feel.

Wank or not, the work I've done for most my life actually puts me in the specific position of listening to different points of view and trying to be, if not objective (don't think I believe in that), then at least balanced. Not only do I understand how people can—and do—think differently than I do, I make it a point to take their thinking seriously. I don't even assume I'm correct, as I think my gradual transformation from believer to atheist shows.

But glad you are "chosen." I definitely am not.

I know you're being sarcastic, but just try and take it as constructive criticism. I've spent many years trying to bridge the gap between atheists and theist; trying to promote cross-understanding; trying to eliminate close-mindedness and show people that it's all right to think differently.

Statements like yours, even though you may have not meant it, sound incredibly pretentious and close-minded. Reread what you wrote:

Why anyone post-Enlightenment would accept that is beyond me.

and then

Not only do I understand how people can—and do—think differently than I do, I make it a point to take their thinking seriously.

You contradicted yourself... so which one is it? Just saying... again, constructive criticism.

Oh yeah... and why do you keep quoting "chosen" when talking about me. I've don't use that word to describe my Calvinism.

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