A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
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08-07-2015, 12:49 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
(08-07-2015 12:28 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  I do assume about people sometimes but it is based on the way they act. If you would have been genuine as you just seemed to be then you wouldn't have been stereotyped as a fake. I agree about your understanding of religion. I might even take your word on the hole I died and didn't see God thing too,but the fact is if you died as you explain(the end) then surely you wouldn't be vomiting blood or typing. As I said before I don't know if our conscious goes on with our energy or not. It could though. And maybe it doesn't for those without Faith. Maybe that's hell. And as far as science bringing you back, it didn't work alone if that was the case. Your outlook on life is surprising as most without guidance seem to be without regard. How did you put it? Kudos. You can break the stubborn clinch of denial. If you have true Faith. For nearly one day you would start to see. It takes devotion though. The opposite of laziness. I really wish you the very best. No hard feelings towards you whatsoever. Good luck to you as well.

While I appreciate your efforts to offer the comfort of something more, I place my faith in humanity. In the many thousands of years human beings have devoted to learning. Except of course through the dark and Middle ages that were the very definition of Christianity, where humanity went backwards based upon biblical ignorance.

I am grateful to human beings and their search for knowledge that saved me more than once. recently I spent 8 months in hospital. During this period, in which I came close to death on more than one occasion, I watched the efforts of the medical professionals. Their dedication. Their care and empathy. That is what inspired me. I nearly come to tears when I think back upon those amazingly sincere efforts I witnessed. Not by gods or fairies or angels or any other fictional characters, but by people. People, pops.

One sad fact I recognise in religions such as Christianity is an utter disregard of human effort. All effort is affordered and accredited to some distant god that never shows himself and can never be felt.

No god was beside an ancient human fighting against a sabretooth tiger ot terror bird. No god was beside that human hunter in the snowy wilderness some 8000 years ago attempting to feed himself and his family.

All of this around us, our great cities, our civilization was born of human effort. Not a gift from a god. Gifts come free of charge. hard work and effort is very different and that is what it is around us.

As a small child somehow I received a child's biblical illustrated text. At age 3 or 4 it made no sense to me. It was stupid. As a result I have never been religious. I am now 51. I have been a non believer in fairy tales for 51 years. There is no going back because there is no back to go to.

I will never be religious. I hold religion in the modern world as outdated and with contempt and cannot understand how any modern educated human being could ever be religious.

There is no converting me. I hold all religion in utter disdain. I totally accept that my death will be the end of me. However, I will live on in the many students I have taught and they will in turn pass that onto their own students. Hopefully with some improvements. As is the human way. To forever improve upon what went before.

I do hope I am able to pass on my views clearly for you. It is late here, now 4.48 am. But I cannot sleep. far too much pain tonight. Which in itself I may not like, but consider natural.

Cheers. Dale

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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08-07-2015, 01:17 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
Dale, that was inspiring. But if you think about it God is all creation. With that being said, we are creation. To put it differently our conscience(our most inner workings) are akin to the observable Universe in many ways. No evibence is needed. We are all one with God/creation and evil/negative. The power is indeed ours. But to unlock it you must truely believe in it. We are opportunity. Not using our opportunity is sin. We are omnipotent in our relation to the Lord, and other forces. It is difficult for me to say because it is very dangerous territory and lying about it is grave. But our conscience is a gift from the Lord and connects us to our potential, which only us as a species have on this plane or in these dimensions or anywhere around here. So we are very special. But chaos and evil would allow us to think otherwise.
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08-07-2015, 01:18 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
Oh yeah,

Sincerely,
Jerry
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08-07-2015, 01:27 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
(08-07-2015 12:26 PM)Banjo Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 12:18 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  I'm sorry for your situation and if I steriotyped. Failure is in no way a virtue. The only good that comes from it is lesson.

Thank you. And I agree. Failure is in no way a virtue. "The meek shall inherit the earth" is one of the most idiotic things I ever read.

In truth, the meek die cold and hungry. Both of which I have experienced.

The bible is not a source of wisdom. It was designed to persecute and control the poor. Never forget this fact.

Good luck to you. Dale
Meek, as in humble, giving, soft spoken. Imagine, if you can a civilization where all people were like that. Would everything not be equal. They would indeed inherit there share.

Also, really, it means that the selfish, wrong doing, evil people will be brought down either from God or from God through death. And I assure you, it will happen.
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08-07-2015, 01:35 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
Hi Jerry. As I said. I do not and never have believed in gods. Others may believe and I am actually in support of it, as long as they do not try to interfere with politics that affect me.

I am a part of the universe. Just as any part is, stars, galaxies etc are all a part of this amazing space. Call it God, call it Cod, makes no difference to me. Although cod exist and in my youth I fished for giant Murray river cod.

But that is another story for another time.

As I said, their is no converting me. No matter how sincere the effort. Although I honestly do appreciate it. With me it is a pointless exercise.

Too many gods over too much time have all proven to be false. There is simply no evidence.

Yesterday I spoke with my cancer specialist about my condition. I have seen many people who have recommended alkaline diets, vitamins... you name it, I have heard it, My doctor told me straight that the cancer will do what the cancer will do. Clinical tests have not proven ny diets to be better, although a healthy diet is obviously better than an unhealthy diet.

My disease is a killer. No two ways about it, but recently I had been given a 2 % chance of survival, and I am still here. I will and have fought on my terms. There is no fictional being for me to turn to. In fact, I saw people let themselves die so they could fall into the arms of Jesus. Well, those people no longer exist. Me, this non believer who clings to life still remains.

Religion can help, but it also kills. I have seen it now many times. 8 months on a cancer ward shows one much.

While your efforts seem sincere now, there is no point in trying to help me through religion. As I said, I hold all religions that believe in an afterlife in utter disdain and contempt.

There is no return from contempt. Smile

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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08-07-2015, 01:44 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
(08-07-2015 01:27 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Meek, as in humble, giving, soft spoken. Imagine, if you can a civilization where all people were like that. Would everything not be equal. They would indeed inherit there share.

Also, really, it means that the selfish, wrong doing, evil people will be brought down either from God or from God through death. And I assure you, it will happen.

Have you ever heard of Leonard Cheshire? Cheshire won the Victoria cross flying with 617 squadron RAF bomber command as a pathfinder. A man of incredible bravery the like of which is hard to match.

After WWII he began a commune based upon the ideals of Christianity and socialism. It failed due to human greed. The great killer of socialism. A reason I disrespect Marx as a philosopher.

The commune was made up of ex RAF personel. All attempting to help each other, but greed destroyed it.

The same can be said of your ideal commune based on the meek all being modest. Humanity, mammals in fact, are hierarchical animals. There will always be an alpha. This is where that idea fails. Which disproves Jesus as god. Did he not understand this concept? Obviously not. Therefore he was not a god. If he existed at all, perhaps he was simply a naive idealist.

We will never know.

Cheers mate. Dale

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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08-07-2015, 02:00 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
(08-07-2015 01:44 PM)Banjo Wrote:  
(08-07-2015 01:27 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  Meek, as in humble, giving, soft spoken. Imagine, if you can a civilization where all people were like that. Would everything not be equal. They would indeed inherit there share.

Also, really, it means that the selfish, wrong doing, evil people will be brought down either from God or from God through death. And I assure you, it will happen.

Have you ever heard of Leonard Cheshire? Cheshire won the Victoria cross flying with 617 squadron RAF bomber command as a pathfinder. A man of incredible bravery the like of which is hard to match.

After WWII he began a commune based upon the ideals of Christianity and socialism. It failed due to human greed. The great killer of socialism. A reason I disrespect Marx as a philosopher.

The commune was made up of ex RAF personel. All attempting to help each other, but greed destroyed it.

The same can be said of your ideal commune based on the meek all being modest. Humanity, mammals in fact, are hierarchical animals. There will always be an alpha. This is where that idea fails. Which disproves Jesus as god. Did he not understand this concept? Obviously not. Therefore he was not a god. If he existed at all, perhaps he was simply a naive idealist.

We will never know.

Cheers mate. Dale
In case you haven't noticed we are the alpha of this Galaxy at the very least. The fact that we refuse to accept this and move toward further betterment isn't an unfixable flaw. That is nearly what evil would have you believe. It is a test of our very character. Opportunity.
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08-07-2015, 02:01 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
You may never know, out of your own pride.
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08-07-2015, 02:17 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
(08-07-2015 02:01 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  You may never know, out of your own pride.

Pops my friend, I am not one for pride. I am but a tiny spec upon a small planet in a galaxy among millions upon millions of other galaxies.

My pride, if it exists, is in my obstinance. In not wanting to die, in wanting to watch my beautiful 2 year old niece grow up. That is all I want really. And I also want to keep teaching music, to share all the information I have gathered over some 30 odd years. Is this pride? Perhaps.

We do not have the luxury of judging ourselves.

Have you ever read In camera, by Sartre? It is a wonderful play and the characters are all dead and are stuck in a hotel room unable to escape from each other. And while there they get to see how they are remembered by those they knew. It is a fascinating play. Although I have not read it in 30 years or more. Ha, if I recall, the definition of hell was "other people". Smile

My pride is small. Do not mistake pride for atheism. Atheism is a non thing. It relies upon non evidence. Upon real evidence proving god or gods exist, atheists will no longer be atheists. If you could prove beyond doubt that a god or afterlife exists, I would not fight it. I would not place my pride before it. What would be the point? It is like saying the moon does not exist, even though it can plainly be seen.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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08-07-2015, 02:25 PM
RE: A little proof, or helpfully evidence.
(08-07-2015 02:00 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  In case you haven't noticed we are the alpha of this Galaxy at the very least. The fact that we refuse to accept this and move toward further betterment isn't an unfixable flaw. That is nearly what evil would have you believe. It is a test of our very character. Opportunity.

It is a huge galaxy pops. A galactic year I believe takes one hundred and fifty million years.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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