"...A position which required prayer."
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13-04-2013, 09:04 PM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
(13-04-2013 08:59 PM)Misanthropik Wrote:  
(13-04-2013 08:52 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  Faking that you believe to please them?

Never.

So there is your personal answer. This, of course, doesn't take away the sting of a father's rejection or disappointment, but who do you have to live with 24/7? Him or you?

I sincerely hope things get better between the two of you over time.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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13-04-2013, 10:53 PM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
Quote:Thirdly, his ignorant explanation of my non-belief was just another way to marginalize the fact that I don't accept their beliefs based on a significant lack of evidence.

Just to pick up on something here.
What your old man is saying is that to be a believer you require a certain amount of proof (to them)?
Which brings in the question, what about a 5year old? One can safely assume that a 5year old knows very little of religion and faith etc.. and yet I'm sure if that kid went to JW church he wouldn't comment that that kid is not a true believer because said kid is not well versed in the ways of Jehovah.

What about those that know less then you about religious shit? Are they not true believers in your fathers eyes?

His statement doesn't make any sense.

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13-04-2013, 11:26 PM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
What I never understand about "no atheists in foxholes" arguments is they don't even sound good from the religious point of view. If this shit made sense, it would make sense in good or bad circumstances. What it seems to be saying is that desperate people will cling to any hope, any comforting nonsense, just to alleviate their fears or whatever. It's kind of like when people prey on grieving people, like asking them if getting terminally ill has made them believe in god.
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14-04-2013, 12:01 AM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
A position of prayer: is that missionary position?

Or is she on her knees...praying...?

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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14-04-2013, 01:03 AM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
With the exception of someone suffering from psychopathy, I believe that most parents love their children. As a grandparent, I believe this doubly-so. When a parent holds the baby and looks down at him/her, one sees so many possibilities, and expresses love. And as the child gets older, the image is there. Granted, sometimes it gets fuzzy when in the midst of an argument, but you will always be the loved one.

And when someone believes that he or she will be one of the 144,000 chosen ones to spend eternity with God, or whatever, the parent wants that for his or her child as well.

And sometimes, in the midst of these fights, we forget the first moment that we met, when we fell in love, and where the parent would have done anything for the younger. Returning to that memory keeps us sane.

I am reminded of the "father and son" song by Cat Stevens.

“I've done everything the Bible says — even the stuff that contradicts the other stuff!"— Ned Flanders
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15-04-2013, 08:03 AM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
Quote:No. Absolutely, plainly, fucking, no. I don't believe, dear father, because to believe would be to accept a demonstrable falsehood on the grounds of irrational religious faith. I do not accept faith as a valid justification for a set of beliefs. For this reason, I would not pray to your god in the first place, regardless of my circumstances, because I don't believe that anyone would be on the other side listening. It's not that I just haven't been in the proper situation, I most certainly have, but I overcame those trying times based on my own strength. My own drive and determination. Not all of us are so weak that we must call out to the celestial version of "Mamma!" when we feel threatened or unsafe. Difficult thought it may be to believe; some of us have the balls to pick ourselves up from the mud and the muck and the shit, and soldier on under our own willpower.

I don't believe, dad, because I don't believe your god exists to give me his assistance in the first place. Period. That is the exact opposite of your baseless assumptions about me, and yet you have the fucking audacity to call me arrogant.

That sentence sent shivers down my spine. Very well written and very powerful.

Anyways, it is best if you don't say that to your dad. In the end it will not change his outlook and just make him mad. Also best for you not to tell him about the suicide attempt. He would just spin it into one of the reasons why you need God and just ignore that it contradicts his own argument.
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16-04-2013, 12:39 AM
RE: "...A position which required prayer."
For entertainment purposes, I'd like to point out that the ad at the bottom of my page read "How to Forgive a Father". lol

Through profound pain comes profound knowledge.
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