A question that every theist should be asked
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08-10-2014, 09:19 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(08-10-2014 09:19 AM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  Not that I disagree or anything but...

When people argue the are usually trying to find a way for both of them to be right ("agree to disagree" ). When you call them out on their god being imaginary you give them no room for compromise. You immediately put them on the defensive, and if they choose to proceed in the argument they are faced with the prospect of either total victory or defeat. If that is what you are going for great, its really effective. Won't be winning you any friends though.

Yes that's true. I'm really not interested in winning friends. My only concern is in coming to the truth. I like to cut right to the chase and at the same time I am opening myself up to being refuted. I'm inviting them to show me why my beliefs are wrong. When dealing with fundamentals, an idea is either right or it's wrong. I prefer to slash through all the bullshit and get to the root.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
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13-10-2014, 01:59 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(08-10-2014 03:10 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  
(08-10-2014 01:16 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  How long a "time"?

Is it confirmation bias if a similar event has occurred in my life dozens of times? With prayer, we're talking about thousands of iterations. If a scientist tests an assumption thousands of times and gets similar results, does he have a confirmatory bias?

You have a poor understanding of scientific method. Since you have a line to god and he answers all of your prayers, lets do a double blind study with controls showing the scientific validity of your assertion.

Hmm, seems they already did that: Long-Awaited Medical Study Questions the Power of Prayer

Anecdotes are not evidence.

I addressed this elsewhere. Thousands of anecdotes aren't being accepted here as evidence, got it. Nor are billions of them (all the people who are in touch with God and etc.)

More importantly, you are showing a possible scientific bias. Or do you tend to look at one prayer study as all-conclusive? Or will you say thousands of repetitions or iterations are anecdotal but one study is utterly conclusive? Thanks.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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13-10-2014, 02:15 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 01:59 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(08-10-2014 03:10 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  You have a poor understanding of scientific method. Since you have a line to god and he answers all of your prayers, lets do a double blind study with controls showing the scientific validity of your assertion.

Hmm, seems they already did that: Long-Awaited Medical Study Questions the Power of Prayer

Anecdotes are not evidence.

I addressed this elsewhere. Thousands of anecdotes aren't being accepted here as evidence, got it. Nor are billions of them (all the people who are in touch with God and etc.)

More importantly, you are showing a possible scientific bias. Or do you tend to look at one prayer study as all-conclusive? Or will you say thousands of repetitions or iterations are anecdotal but one study is utterly conclusive? Thanks.

It doesn't matter how many instances of non-repeatable subjective experiences you have - it's not evidence.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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13-10-2014, 02:34 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 01:59 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(08-10-2014 03:10 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  You have a poor understanding of scientific method. Since you have a line to god and he answers all of your prayers, lets do a double blind study with controls showing the scientific validity of your assertion.

Hmm, seems they already did that: Long-Awaited Medical Study Questions the Power of Prayer

Anecdotes are not evidence.

I addressed this elsewhere. Thousands of anecdotes aren't being accepted here as evidence, got it. Nor are billions of them (all the people who are in touch with God and etc.)

More importantly, you are showing a possible scientific bias. Or do you tend to look at one prayer study as all-conclusive? Or will you say thousands of repetitions or iterations are anecdotal but one study is utterly conclusive? Thanks.

And I suppose under this mountain of anecdotes we'll find Muslim's getting answers from Allah, Buddhists getting answers from Buddha, and any number of other gods. So which anecdotes do we derive truth from?

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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13-10-2014, 02:51 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 02:15 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(13-10-2014 01:59 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  I addressed this elsewhere. Thousands of anecdotes aren't being accepted here as evidence, got it. Nor are billions of them (all the people who are in touch with God and etc.)

More importantly, you are showing a possible scientific bias. Or do you tend to look at one prayer study as all-conclusive? Or will you say thousands of repetitions or iterations are anecdotal but one study is utterly conclusive? Thanks.

It doesn't matter how many instances of non-repeatable subjective experiences you have - it's not evidence.

Close, close! Repeatable and subjective. Eminently repeatable.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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13-10-2014, 02:52 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 02:34 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  
(13-10-2014 01:59 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  I addressed this elsewhere. Thousands of anecdotes aren't being accepted here as evidence, got it. Nor are billions of them (all the people who are in touch with God and etc.)

More importantly, you are showing a possible scientific bias. Or do you tend to look at one prayer study as all-conclusive? Or will you say thousands of repetitions or iterations are anecdotal but one study is utterly conclusive? Thanks.

And I suppose under this mountain of anecdotes we'll find Muslim's getting answers from Allah, Buddhists getting answers from Buddha, and any number of other gods. So which anecdotes do we derive truth from?

I don't know. Don't all these religions and more say they are false gods as well? Satan answers atheist prayers, is what The Q would say. I don't know if I would go quite that far...

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13-10-2014, 02:56 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 02:52 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(13-10-2014 02:34 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  And I suppose under this mountain of anecdotes we'll find Muslim's getting answers from Allah, Buddhists getting answers from Buddha, and any number of other gods. So which anecdotes do we derive truth from?

I don't know. Don't all these religions and more say they are false gods as well? Satan answers atheist prayers, is what The Q would say. I don't know if I would go quite that far...

You are such a passive-aggressive twit. Piss off.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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13-10-2014, 02:59 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 02:52 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  
(13-10-2014 02:34 PM)TheInquisition Wrote:  And I suppose under this mountain of anecdotes we'll find Muslim's getting answers from Allah, Buddhists getting answers from Buddha, and any number of other gods. So which anecdotes do we derive truth from?

I don't know. Don't all these religions and more say they are false gods as well? Satan answers atheist prayers, is what The Q would say. I don't know if I would go quite that far...

Atheists don't pray to imaginary things. There is no reliable way to adjudicate competing claims of which there is no proof. This is the fundamental flaw of all religions, this is why we devised the scientific method as a way to determine objectively, with evidence, which claims are true or not.
When I was a Christian, there were people in my church that were quite deranged, but as long as they could quote the bible, they would be listened to.
This is a deeply flawed way of discerning truth. And I would add, that this is exactly what the Apostle Paul was.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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13-10-2014, 04:42 PM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(08-10-2014 09:12 AM)diddo97 Wrote:  Why would I want to imagine a God that wants me to go to hell?

You tell us. You're the one that did it.
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14-10-2014, 09:59 AM
RE: A question that every theist should be asked
(13-10-2014 02:56 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(13-10-2014 02:52 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  I don't know. Don't all these religions and more say they are false gods as well? Satan answers atheist prayers, is what The Q would say. I don't know if I would go quite that far...

You are such a passive-aggressive twit. Piss off.

Again, this very forum suggests asking questions and learning. If you consider questions submitted to you respectfully passive-aggressive, I can be more direct. Please do not be a schoolteacher or college professor, ever! Thanks.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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