Adam and Eve
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15-07-2016, 03:03 PM
RE: Adam and Eve
(08-01-2016 05:19 PM)Zen Wrote:  Why did God give Adam and Eve the option to take the apple? Why did he give them the free will to commit a 'sin'?
It makes no sense.

The whole point of the story is to teach total mindless obedience to an authority figure who has ultimate control over you. It's saying "Don't bother using critical thought or asking questions why these rules are in place, just do what you're told...or else!"

We have to remember that Adam and Eve were idiots, they were naive children and couldn't even understand why they were being told to do anything to begin with. They couldn't know it was a test.

The snake at least gave them the choice but again, they were stupid, they should've asked God, "Why can't I eat from the tree? Because I will surely die? Why is that tree even here if it's poison? What is death? Why is death bad? What is good and bad? Why is listening to you good and disobeying you bad?" etc.

They never got to ask these questions, they were fooled and "tempted" to eat the fruit, never given a second chance, never told what the exact punishment would be but still got punished. We are all born tainted now because God is a jerk who likes fucking around with dumb people.

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15-07-2016, 04:45 PM
RE: Adam and Eve
(15-07-2016 03:03 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  
(08-01-2016 05:19 PM)Zen Wrote:  Why did God give Adam and Eve the option to take the apple? Why did he give them the free will to commit a 'sin'?
It makes no sense.

The whole point of the story is to teach total mindless obedience to an authority figure who has ultimate control over you. It's saying "Don't bother using critical thought or asking questions why these rules are in place, just do what you're told...or else!"

We have to remember that Adam and Eve were idiots, they were naive children and couldn't even understand why they were being told to do anything to begin with. They couldn't know it was a test.

The snake at least gave them the choice but again, they were stupid, they should've asked God, "Why can't I eat from the tree? Because I will surely die? Why is that tree even here if it's poison? What is death? Why is death bad? What is good and bad? Why is listening to you good and disobeying you bad?" etc.

They never got to ask these questions, they were fooled and "tempted" to eat the fruit, never given a second chance, never told what the exact punishment would be but still got punished. We are all born tainted now because God is a jerk who likes fucking around with dumb people.

It's even worse than that, all of humanity was judged for the act of two people.

I'm not sure you can treat this story seriously even as a metaphor, do we dismiss things like people being held accountable for things they have nothing to do with?

Do we dismiss the severe punishment for one innocent act?

Do we dismiss how this god shows zero pity or understanding for people he made in his own image?

I just don't think there's a whole lot you can take that's actually useful from this story. Maybe Aliza's metaphorical approach is about as good as it gets, but you have to ignore many of the other elements of the story and it's broad implications about this god character.

It's such a fucked up story that an intelligent person will put the book down and laugh at it after the first few chapters. Maybe that's the ultimate lesson to be learned.

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
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15-07-2016, 06:08 PM
RE: Adam and Eve
Borrowed from City-Data.com Wrote:Finally, something that makes sense of the Biblical story of the Garden of Eden! Go to their website or something...

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But on a semi-serious note, was God looking out for himself? Or is the snake liberal media?

[INDENT]YHWH, God, commanded concerning the human, saying:
From every (other) tree of the garden you may eat, yes, eat,
but from the Tree of Knowing of Good and Evil -
you are not to eat from it,
for on the day that you eat from it, you must die, yes, die.
(Gen 2:16-17 SB Fox)

The snake said to the woman:
Die, you will not die!
Rather, God knows
that on the day you eat from it, your eyes will be opened
and you will become like gods, knowing good and evil.
(3:4-5)

She took from its fruit and ate
and gave also to her husband beside her,
and he ate.
The eyes of the two of them were opened
and they knew then
that they were nude.
(3:6-7)

YHWH, God, said:
Here, the human has become like one of us, knowing good and evil.
So now, lest he send forth his hand
and take also from the Tree of Life
and eat
and live throughout the ages...!
So YHWH, God, sent him away...
(3:22-23)
[/INDENT]
Humans almost became divine in that little ol' garden, and the gods didn't seem too keen on the idea of additional members to the divine family. Smile

P.S. I would have included this as a post in the "Is Satan bad" thread, but you know... Satan had nothing to do with the Garden story or the snake, and I'd hate to be accused of being unable to read.
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16-07-2016, 04:53 AM
RE: Adam and Eve
Sita beat me to it. But yea, it's suppose to teach mindless self-oppression to leaders and authoritarian figures.
It's because it's authoritarian figures wrote/molded the bible so that they could justify being dicks to other humans and eat grapes and get fanned all day while everyone else mindlessly tended the fields.

Religion is obsolete in this regards. Now we just have modern consumerism.
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09-10-2016, 03:11 PM
RE: Adam and Eve
I always thought they had free will from the beginning.
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09-10-2016, 04:07 PM
RE: Adam and Eve
(09-10-2016 03:11 PM)MsMacintosh Wrote:  I always thought they had free will from the beginning.

They didn't exist, so why is this at all important? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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10-10-2016, 08:54 AM
RE: Adam and Eve
I find the fictional story of Adam & Eve to be an interesting one.

What physical traits did Adam have and if he has flaws then that implies the creator of Adam was unable to detect the flaws or that the flaws were intentional.

If you intentionally add flaws, then you are setting up your creation for failure. What does that imply about the character of the creator if all flaws lead you to a one way path to torment ?

Does Adam have any bacteria in his gut when created ?
The gut is swarming with about 100 trillion bacteria, or flora, which outnumber human cells in our body 10 to 1.

If our gut contains 10 times more bacteria than human cells, then perhaps this god created bacteria with a human host around it.

Does Adam have an immune system ?
Why would he need one ?

Just a few questions to mull over if you enjoy contemplating this story.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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10-10-2016, 09:09 AM
RE: Adam and Eve
What I find interesting and something that most Christians fail to think about is that their god made the snake too. This deity story has so many trip wires placed all over that garden that there's no way to avoid them.

The other question is, if a god is omniscient he knew in advance everything that would take place even before he started creating light yet he goes ahead and starts the process of creation. How then is he merciful knowing he's creating people who will by their own free will go to hell for eternity.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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