Am I agnostic or atheist?

[germanyt]

I'm tired of seeing threads on the forum regarding this topic so I thought we could weigh in on the Intro section.

I'll start by offering my perspective on this and welcome any discussion on it. I will start by breaking down the definition of the word.

Agnosticism is the view that the truth values of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—are unknown or unknowable.


This is pretty self explanatory. It basically describes the idea that the existence of God can't be known. I'm sure we (most of us) can agree that the world would be a much smarter place if only these kinds of people existed.

So what is gnosticism? Pretty much the opposite. It's the idea that the existence of something, specifically a deity can be known or is knowable.


Now we get down to terms dealing specifically with belief in a deity, atheism and theism. They are pretty simple. Atheism is the lack of belief in a deity and theism is the belief in a deity. So the difference in being a gnostic atheist and an agnostic atheist is merely the difference in disbelieving in God and either thinking that God's non-existence can be known or cannot be known. Here are some definitions by your's truly that might help everyone here decide which term defines them best.

Gnostic theist - A person who believes in God and claims to know for a fact that God exists. You're probably already aware that the vast majority of theists are gnostic theists.

Agnostic theist - A person who believes in God but admits that there is either a lack of evidence of God or that there is significant evidence that indicates there might not be a god and allows for the idea that God might not exist.

Gnostic atheist - A person who does not believe in God and claims to know for a fact that God doesn't exist. You may or may have not met an athiest like this. They are as rare or even more rare than agnostic theists.

Agnostic atheist - A person who does not believe in God but admits that there is no true way of knowing whether or not God exists.



In order to find out which defines you personally you must first decide whether evidence for or against God exists. You may find this exausting. It will take hundreds of hours of study. Only after the research can you decide for yourself whether or not you believe that God exists. Afterwards you need to decide the certainty with which you accept the evidence you have researched.



I have more to post but my daughter is screaming with diaper rash.

[houseofcantor]

Dude. You made a mess.

Agnostic is just a PC/BS term, far as I'm concerned. If you don't know, why you flapping yer gums?

[germanyt]

Fixed. I was just opening my 7th beer when I started typing that.

[Magoo]

Agnostic theist is down twice. Second one is mis-spelled .

[TheBeardedDude]

Someone else is feeling smarmy today.

[Erxomai]

Poor GT. No good deed goes unpunished around here.

[NotSoVacuous]

I look at it this way. We label things for what they are. We do not label things by what they are not.

If a person believes in god(s), then they are a theist.
If a person does not believe in god(s), then they are an anti-theist.
However, I do not label the anti-theist no more than I would label and anti-racist.

This is all I see. I don't care if someone calls themselves agnostic or not. You are anti-theist to me. I am not going out of my way to call you an atheist, but you are.

Besides, to speak in certainties like agnostics do is just ridiculous. Who says we can't know of a god one day? There might actually be a way to identify one. It might show itself, or we might discover a way to see it. So I personally don't agree with the idea of speaking in certainties that we can't know.

[germanyt]

(19-05-2012 09:11 PM)NotSoVacuous Wrote:  I look at it this way. We label things for what they are. We do not label things by what they are not.

If a person believes in god(s), then they are a theist.
If a person does not believe in god(s), then they are an anti-theist.
However, I do not label the anti-theist no more than I would label and anti-racist.

This is all I see. I don't care if someone calls themselves agnostic or not. You are anti-theist to me. I am not going out of my way to call you an atheist, but you are.

Besides, to speak in certainties like agnostics do is just ridiculous. Who says we can't know of a god one day? There might actually be a way to identify one. It might show itself, or we might discover a way to see it. So I personally don't agree with the idea of speaking in certainties that we can't know.

Not an anti-theist. You would be a non theist. Anti-theist usually refers to a person who is opposed on principle to theism. They tend to be referred to as militant. As for certainties, God may be proven one day. It would require the observable presence of that god. There will never be proof of no god.

[Filox]

There could be a proof for no God, we discover him, we prove he exists, we find him, them we shot his ass in the head with a silver unholy bullet and there, his dead body is the proof for no god.