America and debtors prison.

[tazmin98]

(30-07-2011 03:24 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  

(30-07-2011 02:41 PM)tazmin98 Wrote:  I think it's because:
-the U.S borrowed so much money from other countries such as China,Japan, Britain etc.
-Failing educational system, people without good education can't support a technology-based economy.
- The government spends WAY more money than it take in in taxes.

From Britain, the country, or British banks? Because, if from Britain the country, to whom does Britain owe all its debts? To whom does Japan? All, all to China?
Well, it that were true, the solution is simple: let China repossess all American holdings on its territory, just like banks repossess homes (They're going to, anyway - you know this, right?) and call it even and start over with industry on US soil, employing US citizens, so they can earn some money and pay some taxes.

If to banks, on the other hand... I say, let 'em fall. Usurers will just build new banks, but it'd give you a breathing space.

Failing education system isn't going to be fixed any time soon by slashing its funding even more. I also don't foresee the tax base growing wider or healthier by chopping off the unions and firing all the people who earn a living wage.
I don't hear much about cutting intelligence, black ops, military or homeland security. I wonder why?

ahh... this is why I hate Politics, it's too damn confusing.

Here is why: America...
owe Japan $585.9 billion
owe China $541 billion
owe the U.K $307.4 billion(Sorry about Britain meant the U.K)
owe the OPEC nations (such as Algeria, Angola, Ecuador, Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, etc.), a total of $179.8 billion
owe Caribbean banking Centers $147.7 billion (Bahamas, Bermuda, Cayman Islands, Panama, to name a few).
here is a link if you want to find out more--->link

Look I don't understand what is going, I only understand a jist of it. But what can you say, I am only 13

[Peterkin]

Hey, Tazmin, sorry about giving you a hard time.
You don't need to understand all the financial details yet, but you're a smart enough young cookie to know that the media and government pr people are lying. (Your parents and teachers should understand and demand a full accounting, but i bet they don't; bet they just accept the lies.)
Think about just this bit: If the US owes the UK and Japanese governments, and the UK and Japan owe the US (Trust me: the UK and Japanese governments tell their people that they owe the US, and that's why they have to cut social spending.) then they could just get together and agree to write off their mutual debts. If the US owed middle eastern countries for oil supplies (Natch - what else?) then those countries also owe the US big bucks for weapons, so the government representatives could get together and write off their mutual debts.
In a sensible world, this is exactly what would happen.
But it can't happen, because the national governments don't really owe to one another, but to banks that are headquartered in each of those countries, plus in tax shelters in the Caribbean. (Obviously: Caribbean islands have no money to lend; have barely enough to survive, which is why they need to host international pirates in the first place.)
Also, no matter what else is said on the subject, keep in mind that this money people and countries supposedly owe is mostly interest. That is, money that has never been spent, never been borrowed, never been printed, never existed in any form except as projected profits on a computer screen.
It's the biggest, most vicious con job in the history of the world.

[tazmin98]

(01-08-2011 12:50 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  Hey, Tazmin, sorry about giving you a hard time.
You don't need to understand all the financial details yet, but you're a smart enough young cookie to know that the media and government pr people are lying. (Your parents and teachers should understand and demand a full accounting, but i bet they don't; bet they just accept the lies.)
Think about just this bit: If the US owes the UK and Japanese governments, and the UK and Japan owe the US (Trust me: the UK and Japanese governments tell their people that they owe the US, and that's why they have to cut social spending.) then they could just get together and agree to write off their mutual debts. If the US owed middle eastern countries for oil supplies (Natch - what else?) then those countries also owe the US big bucks for weapons, so the government representatives could get together and write off their mutual debts.
In a sensible world, this is exactly what would happen.
But it can't happen, because the national governments don't really owe to one another, but to banks that are headquartered in each of those countries, plus in tax shelters in the Caribbean. (Obviously: Caribbean islands have no money to lend; have barely enough to survive, which is why they need to host international pirates in the first place.)
Also, no matter what else is said on the subject, keep in mind that this money people and countries supposedly owe is mostly interest. That is, money that has never been spent, never been borrowed, never been printed, never existed in any form except as projected profits on a computer screen.
It's the biggest, most vicious con job in the history of the world.

it's alright love

So it's the banks

There are the reason U.K bankrupt in the first place!!!!(It's actually the bankers who got too much money on their bonuses)
What people need to do is change people who run the finances and the banks(really don't know who but if it's the people who caused this and are not doing a damn thing), because if we have the same people after all this has ended( IF it ends) it's going to happen again!!!!
Sorry U.K rant

But wasn't Bush the cause of the debt with his wars?
and how can America be debt free?

Random question: What do think of the movie Battleship that is coming out
Found this clock----Debt clock

[Lilith Pride]

The banks have been disestablished before in many different instances. They become week for a while, but eventually regain their control on the money supplies. In truth taking them apart only promises a return to this point in a few centuries.Perhaps even less than 100 years nowadays. The well established system for banking has always and will always cheat people in this way, there is unfortunately not much chance of it actually being changed. Fix the current heads and their children will fuck it up.

[Peterkin]

Ya, that's pretty much it.
Not banks, exactly: those are just institutions. Like any other other institution, they could be run well, for the benefit of society, or badly, for the benefit of a few. Really, it's the people who end up running the institutions that cause all the trouble. We know what rises to the top.
Where there is money at the center of things, there will be greedy-guts to suck it all up and leave none for anybody else. Politicians can't do much, coz the rich bastards own them, too.
Read a book called Flying Dutch, by Tom Holt, if you can get hold of it. Very funny. Or at least see the movie Bulworth. Even funnier (coarse language warning)

Oh i forgot to answer Tazmin. Bush and the wars didn't exactly help. (Ever ask why wars cost so much? Where, exactly the money goes? Who gets even richer?) The sainted Reagan had already cut taxes for the rich and deregulated everything in a very destructive way. But the problem goes way further back.
How anybody gets out of debt: 1. Kill the creditors or 2. Take over the bank or 3. Default or 4. Pass a law declaring all debts null and void or 5. Overthrow the government and print new currency or 6. Stop using money altogether. You may think of more ways. Be creative.

[Lilith Pride]

I generally go with kill the creditors. Maybe we could deport them or put them in a mental institution. =p Seriously though I'm not very fond of those who let greed get to them, and force a lot of people to suffer so that their numbers look prettier. I really suck at living in this society, because I feel bad even taking a job knowing that someone else could have used this job. I don't want to step on others' backs in order to live.

[tazmin98]

(01-08-2011 07:45 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  Ya, that's pretty much it.
Not banks, exactly: those are just institutions. Like any other other institution, they could be run well, for the benefit of society, or badly, for the benefit of a few. Really, it's the people who end up running the institutions that cause all the trouble. We know what rises to the top.
Where there is money at the center of things, there will be greedy-guts to suck it all up and leave none for anybody else. Politicians can't do much, coz the rich bastards own them, too.
Read a book called Flying Dutch, by Tom Holt, if you can get hold of it. Very funny. Or at least see the movie Bulworth. Even funnier (coarse language warning)

Oh i forgot to answer Tazmin. Bush and the wars didn't exactly help. (Ever ask why wars cost so much? Where, exactly the money goes? Who gets even richer?) The sainted Reagan had already cut taxes for the rich and deregulated everything in a very destructive way. But the problem goes way further back.
How anybody gets out of debt: 1. Kill the creditors or 2. Take over the bank or 3. Default or 4. Pass a law declaring all debts null and void or 5. Overthrow the government and print new currency or 6. Stop using money altogether. You may think of more ways. Be creative.

Going with Lilith, kill those creditors!!!!!

What is up with debt vote? heard that the Democrats were split on the vote

[Observer]

(01-08-2011 07:45 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  1. Kill the creditors or 2. Take over the bank or 3. Default or 4. Pass a law declaring all debts null and void or 5. Overthrow the government and print new currency or 6. Stop using money altogether. You may think of more ways. Be creative.

7 want less

(The rule of the diminishing returning needs)

[GirlyMan]

(02-08-2011 01:45 PM)The_observer Wrote:  

(01-08-2011 07:45 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  1. Kill the creditors or 2. Take over the bank or 3. Default or 4. Pass a law declaring all debts null and void or 5. Overthrow the government and print new currency or 6. Stop using money altogether. You may think of more ways. Be creative.

7 want less

(The rule of the diminishing returning needs)

8) need less.

[Peterkin]

A quick thought on administrative impotence:
Every time i hear one of those guys (mostly that guy) say: "Don't tax the job-creators!"
Obama should reply: "Okay. For every job you create, you get a tax exemption. For every job you terminate, downgrade, export or destroy, you get a tax increase. Fair?"
Why doesn't he?