An Atheist Spirituality?
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22-10-2013, 12:46 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
If violence is bad, then why is it so enjoyable to watch Smile

Theism is to believe what other people claim, Atheism is to ask "why should I".
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22-10-2013, 12:53 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
(22-10-2013 12:46 PM)sporehux Wrote:  If violence is bad, then why is it so enjoyable to watch Smile




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22-10-2013, 02:00 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
Spiritualism is objectionable. Different meanings to every person. Its vague and covers basically everything. Running can be a spiritual experience, playing music, when I'm drawing I get a sense of fulfilment, maybe you could say spiritual. It all makes perfect sense when you see spirit as only a metaphor for heightened experience or awareness. It makes no difference if you're religious or not, any human can experience it. They just derive their ideas from different sources.

"I don't have to have faith, I have experience." Joseph Campbell
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22-10-2013, 02:24 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
(22-10-2013 12:09 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(22-10-2013 12:57 AM)Dark Light Wrote:  Fuck that noise! What's with all that 'turn the other cheek' bullshit?

I think that lesson is often misinterpreted to mean "Roll over like a pussy" where the actual lesson is "Practice restraint or someone's gonna get hurt and it ain't gonna be Girly". Big Grin

So a Christian atheist doesn't differ from any other Christian when it comes to interpreting scripture to suit. Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-10-2013, 03:26 PM (This post was last modified: 22-10-2013 03:36 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
(22-10-2013 02:24 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(22-10-2013 12:09 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  I think that lesson is often misinterpreted to mean "Roll over like a pussy" where the actual lesson is "Practice restraint or someone's gonna get hurt and it ain't gonna be Girly". Big Grin

So a Christian atheist doesn't differ from any other Christian when it comes to interpreting scripture to suit. Consider

Yup, that's right of course. But so the fuck what? That's true of the interpretation of anything, it's inherent to the concept of interpretation, interpretation is open to interpretation, it's kinda like what interpretation means. I will say that as someone who realizes any promise of a preservation of identity is utter and complete nonsense bullshit, my interpretation is completely foreign and alien to most Christians. 'Cept for KingsChosen but he just ain't ready to give up his fairy tales and accept it yet. But he will. Fairy tales are for fools and fraidy cats. He knows this. Big Grin

Why you got a problem with Christian atheists, old man? That's like saying you got a problem with followers of that devil cult leader T.S. Eliot. Tongue

I should have been a pair of ragged claws
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As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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22-10-2013, 03:53 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
(21-10-2013 04:16 AM)Yasmin Wrote:  If we choose to define spirituality as the search for something sacred in our lives- whether that be God, the universe, the connection between humans (eg. between mother and child, love, etc), or the meaning of life; Basically anything that takes us out of existing just as a biological being- do you believe that you can be spiritual without being religious?

This is an unfortunate attitude for humanity to take. What is wrong with simply being a biological being? Does it make one's love go stale? Does it rob us of our passions and interests? I don't understand how being a body is worse than believing you have a spirit.

Even if the idea of being a biological being only were reprehensible, it still wouldn't have any compelling evidence. In my life, being a genuine person means accepting evidence even when I don't like its nature, or the answers that it leads me to. When there is compelling and empirical evidence of spirit, I will sit up and take notice. Until then, the body seems to function perfectly in living and loving without that assumption.

(21-10-2013 04:16 AM)Yasmin Wrote:  I was wanting to know:
- What is your definition of spirituality?

I define spirituality as the belief in an unseen world of beings and locations which cannot be seen by humans. Some would refer to it as a parallel or even coinciding world. Spirituality gives rise to the idea of the soul, or the true self that governs and animates the physical body. In other words, one must believe that humans "have" bodies, rather than that we "are" bodies.

(21-10-2013 04:16 AM)Yasmin Wrote:  - Why do you/ don't you think an atheist can be spiritual?


An Atheist can be spiritual if he or she desires. They will then be a hypocrite, claiming no belief in religion because of too little evidence, while simultaneously believing something equally lacking in evidence. The claims of the spiritual are no better verified than the beliefs of the fundamentally religious.

(21-10-2013 04:16 AM)Yasmin Wrote:  - If you reject spirituality as a concept, how would you define the search for meaning/ connection in our lives?

Anyone who is actively searching for meaning in life, has got the wrong idea. If you can't find meaning in loving your family and friends, performing the activities you love, and experiencing both the pains and pleasures of daily living, I suspect you will live life as an unhappy and unfulfilled person, no matter what meaning you eventually profess.

One could argue that desire to know about the universe is not harmful, and is likely a wonderful thing. To those interested in learning such secrets, I recommend the honest pursuit of science. Perhaps your desire for meaning, can be transformed into a desire to understand reality?

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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22-10-2013, 04:13 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
(22-10-2013 03:53 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  An Atheist can be spiritual if he or she desires. They will then be a hypocrite, claiming no belief in religion because of too little evidence, while simultaneously believing something equally lacking in evidence. The claims of the spiritual are no better verified than the beliefs of the fundamentally religious.

I hate the tendency people have to throw around the word hypocrite (not that it isn't *sometimes* applicable). You can see into someone's mind and somehow determine that they're insincere ?

Sorry if that comes across confrontational. It grates my carrot, is all.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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24-10-2013, 09:36 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
As I live my life, sometimes I make mistakes. Sometimes I say or do something that I regret, or that turns out to be wrong. This is one of those times.

(22-10-2013 03:53 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  I define spirituality as the belief in an unseen world of beings and locations which cannot be seen by humans. Some would refer to it as a parallel or even coinciding world. Spirituality gives rise to the idea of the soul, or the true self that governs and animates the physical body. In other words, one must believe that humans "have" bodies, rather than that we "are" bodies.

The more I think about it now, the less I can define spirituality at all. What is it? Is it physical? No. Where else could it exist then? In the mind. Is it conceptual? Well, not according to those who believe it is real. Then what is it?

The best I can do is say that it only exists in the mind, which is as good as saying it doesn't exist at all.

Although, in a technical sense I don't "sense" the physical world as it really is, rather I "perceive" it using the limited, corruptible software and hardware of my body. So, technically, the physical world is also only in my mind. Does that mean it isn't real outside of me?

Is the presence of another person near me evidence that it exists outside of my mind? I think so....

(22-10-2013 03:53 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  An Atheist can be spiritual if he or she desires. They will then be a hypocrite, claiming no belief in religion because of too little evidence, while simultaneously believing something equally lacking in evidence. The claims of the spiritual are no better verified than the beliefs of the fundamentally religious.

Here I decided to speak for all Atheists, while only using my own opinion. I apologize. Clearly every Atheist has their own opinion, and doesn't need me getting it wrong, while representing them without their permission.

Let me rephrase....

"I do not believe in anything spiritual because I have not encountered enough evidence to support it. If I intend to dismiss religion for having too little evidence, I would be a hypocrite if I didn't hold myself to a standard of consistent argument. No double standards. The claims of the spiritual are no better verified than the beliefs of the fundamentally religious."

(22-10-2013 03:53 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  Anyone who is actively searching for meaning in life, has got the wrong idea. If you can't find meaning in loving your family and friends, performing the activities you love, and experiencing both the pains and pleasures of daily living, I suspect you will live life as an unhappy and unfulfilled person, no matter what meaning you eventually profess.

Here we go again....

"I don't feel the need to search for a meaning to replace the one I had as a believer, because it turns out, I never needed that one to begin with. I have found meaning in loving my family and friends, doing things I love to do, and experiencing the pain and pleasure of daily living. If I had been unable to do this, I surely would have led a sad and unfulfilled life. "

My sincere apologies. I will try to represent myself better in the future.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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24-10-2013, 11:56 PM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
... My respect for you just went up several notches again Smile

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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25-10-2013, 07:53 AM
RE: An Atheist Spirituality?
(22-10-2013 03:26 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(22-10-2013 02:24 PM)Chas Wrote:  So a Christian atheist doesn't differ from any other Christian when it comes to interpreting scripture to suit. Consider

Yup, that's right of course. But so the fuck what? That's true of the interpretation of anything, it's inherent to the concept of interpretation, interpretation is open to interpretation, it's kinda like what interpretation means. I will say that as someone who realizes any promise of a preservation of identity is utter and complete nonsense bullshit, my interpretation is completely foreign and alien to most Christians. 'Cept for KingsChosen but he just ain't ready to give up his fairy tales and accept it yet. But he will. Fairy tales are for fools and fraidy cats. He knows this. Big Grin

Why you got a problem with Christian atheists, old man? That's like saying you got a problem with followers of that devil cult leader T.S. Eliot. Tongue

I should have been a pair of ragged claws
Scuttling across the floors of silent seas.

I don't have a problem with Christian atheists, except the term is oxymoronic.

I'm just saying that a text that can be interpreted to mean anything probably means nothing.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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