An Atheist who Found God
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04-01-2017, 09:41 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 09:34 AM)tomilay Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 07:34 AM)Vosur Wrote:  While I can only speak for myself, I think it's fair to say that I'm not the only atheist on here who strongly disagrees with the notion that we respect theists like KC because their personal philosophies and theologies are somehow "complex and mature."

How can you even say that with a straight face?

It's also not cool to conflate disagreements with or criticisms of a person's world views with liking or disliking, respecting or disrespecting that individual person.
I never looked at it that way, and probably should have, you make an interesting point there tomilay.
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04-01-2017, 09:57 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 09:41 AM)adey67 Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 09:34 AM)tomilay Wrote:  It's also not cool to conflate disagreements with or criticisms of a person's world views with liking or disliking, respecting or disrespecting that individual person.
I never looked at it that way, and probably should have, you make an interesting point there tomilay.

True, but I find it difficult to respect somebody who knows they have an irrational belief but clings to it anyway for not better reason than it gives them comfort.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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04-01-2017, 10:04 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 09:57 AM)unfogged Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 09:41 AM)adey67 Wrote:  I never looked at it that way, and probably should have, you make an interesting point there tomilay.

True, but I find it difficult to respect somebody who knows they have an irrational belief but clings to it anyway for not better reason than it gives them comfort.

You're one of those guys who likes to take the blankie away from the baby to watch it cry when you play hide and seek with it aren't you. ... I mean don't get me wrong, it's fun and all as long as the mother doesn't spot you.

#sigh
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04-01-2017, 10:07 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 09:01 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 08:46 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  What if I had a drug that would make you see orange unicorns (let's put aside for the moment the fact that I actually do have such a drug) and slipped it to you (it's very tiny, I could administer it to you in a handshake and you wouldn't even notice) and then you saw orange unicorns in a picture you have never seen before (so no context to work from). Is it rational to believe there are unicorns in the picture or not?

Let me take your metaphor a step further. My drug is so selective that you only see orange unicorns in this picture (it's not, you see orange unicorns everywhere) and nowhere else. Everyone tells you there is no unicorn in the picture. The author tells you there is no unicorn in the picture. You don't feel any different under the drug, you have no reason to suspect that some Girlyman is playing deus deceptor with your perceptions and every time you look at the picture you see an orange unicorn. What is the rational thing to believe?

Nope, wouldn't be rational. My personal experience would not match independent observations of the picture. My personal experience would not match experiments done with the picture to confirm what ONLY I was seeing.

Therefore I would conclude that something was altering my perception of reality.

If you see a unicorn and you're unaware that you've been drugged, it's perfectly rational to conclude that there was a real unicorn there.

Later, when you learned you'd been drugged and the security camera did not record a unicorn, it would be irrational to cling to the belief that you previously held under different terms.
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04-01-2017, 11:03 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 07:34 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(03-01-2017 09:19 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  If you can't even master this "simple" truth about one individual then why would you expect the same from theists about a personal philosophy and theology that is complex and mature enough to earn the grudging respect of a forum full of atheists?
While I can only speak for myself, I think it's fair to say that I'm not the only atheist on here who strongly disagrees with the notion that we respect theists like KC because their personal philosophies and theologies are somehow "complex and mature."

How can you even say that with a straight face?

You're welcome to your opinion. I can respect a person that I disagree with. I offer you the following thought experiment:

You are about to be condemned to 24 hours in a locked room with three other people. As you are marched to the end of the hall where this is to transpire you notice two doors. On one the names "KingsChosen", "Aliza", and "Shai-Hulud" are listed. The other features "Q", "TheBorg", and "CalloftheWild".

Choose wisely.

---
Flesh and blood of a dead star, slain in the apocalypse of supernova, resurrected by four billion years of continuous autocatalytic reaction and crowned with the emergent property of sentience in the dream that the universe might one day understand itself.
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04-01-2017, 11:10 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 11:03 AM)Paleophyte Wrote:  ...
You're welcome to your opinion. I can respect a person that I disagree with. I offer you the following thought experiment:

You are about to be condemned to 24 hours in a locked room with three other people. As you are marched to the end of the hall where this is to transpire you notice two doors. On one the names "KingsChosen", "Aliza", and "Shai-Hulud" are listed. The other features "Q", "TheBorg", and "CalloftheWild".

Choose wisely.

I don't see what that has to do with Vos's remark but given that choice ... gimme the latter. Yes, please.

It'd be gold!

Laugh out load

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04-01-2017, 11:16 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 11:10 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 11:03 AM)Paleophyte Wrote:  ...
You're welcome to your opinion. I can respect a person that I disagree with. I offer you the following thought experiment:

You are about to be condemned to 24 hours in a locked room with three other people. As you are marched to the end of the hall where this is to transpire you notice two doors. On one the names "KingsChosen", "Aliza", and "Shai-Hulud" are listed. The other features "Q", "TheBorg", and "CalloftheWild".

Choose wisely.

I don't see what that has to do with Vos's remark but given that choice ... gimme the latter. Yes, please.

It'd be gold!

Laugh out load

But only for the first 4 hours. "No Exit" or "Idiocracy". Consider

#sigh
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04-01-2017, 11:20 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 11:16 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 11:10 AM)DLJ Wrote:  I don't see what that has to do with Vos's remark but given that choice ... gimme the latter. Yes, please.

It'd be gold!

Laugh out load

But only for the first 4 hours.

But what a test of stamina it would be!

Can we do it without food and drink like Jesus in the wilderness or Mo in his cave?

But I've got to have a some way of making notes... no point if there ain't gonna be some revelations coming out of it.

Big Grin

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04-01-2017, 11:26 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 11:20 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 11:16 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  But only for the first 4 hours.

But what a test of stamina it would be!

Can we do it without food and drink like Jesus in the wilderness or Mo in his cave?

But I've got to have a some way of making notes... no point if there ain't gonna be some revelations coming out of it.

Big Grin

Think we'd have to bring puppets and balloon animals or things could get ugly. Magic tricks too. You never know when you might have to pull a quarter out of someone's ear. .... Consider .... shadow hands!




#sigh
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04-01-2017, 11:31 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 11:03 AM)Paleophyte Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 07:34 AM)Vosur Wrote:  While I can only speak for myself, I think it's fair to say that I'm not the only atheist on here who strongly disagrees with the notion that we respect theists like KC because their personal philosophies and theologies are somehow "complex and mature."

How can you even say that with a straight face?

You're welcome to your opinion. I can respect a person that I disagree with. I offer you the following thought experiment:

You are about to be condemned to 24 hours in a locked room with three other people. As you are marched to the end of the hall where this is to transpire you notice two doors. On one the names "KingsChosen", "Aliza", and "Shai-Hulud" are listed. The other features "Q", "TheBorg", and "CalloftheWild".

Choose wisely.

Oh yeah, and we're gettin' freaky in my room. Choose wisely, Vosur. Choose very wisely.
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