An Atheist who Found God
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
05-01-2017, 01:08 PM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(05-01-2017 11:25 AM)mordant Wrote:  A new policy has gone out on Religion & Spirituality that no threads are to be started on science topics. It is a curious policy because there have BEEN no such threads. There have been threads such as "The Importance of Science in Religious Discussions" which has been shut down on the pretext that it had a lot of 'bickering' and went off-topic.

Why don't mods just move threads to the appropriate area when they're misplaced? Looks like some sort of attempt to keep threads on-topic and not derailed. Or it could just be mods on a power trip. Think we might've tried something like that years ago when two 20yo Lord of the Flies goobers full of themselves took it upon themselves to rewrite the forum rules despite vigorous objection from some of us. For our own good of course. Can't remember whether they were laughed out or just left on their own but they felt the need to kill Piggy before they left.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes GirlyMan's post
05-01-2017, 05:37 PM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(05-01-2017 01:08 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Why don't mods just move threads to the appropriate area when they're misplaced?
They have done that in the past.

But in this case, things don't add up. The new policy is no science threads in R&S, but as I mentioned, there haven't BEEN any such threads. What there have been are threads for example discussing the importance of science in religious discussions. That is still fundamentally a religious topic.

In any case what is actually happening is since this new policy, is threads have been closed solely because of relevant science-based arguments or opinions offered in the religion & spirituality form. The specific example that comes to mind is someone was asserting that god created everything and someone else said that there is no creation event, but a big bang event. And that poster was warned not to contradict the poster's belief in god with some evolution vs creation argument (which of course is not even a remotely accurate characterization of what was going on). This warning came from a theist poster on the thread, not a mod, but you can see they are warming to this approach to shutting down dissent, and the mod did not intervene in the matter last I looked.

What makes this worse is that there are less general forums for, e.g., Christianity, Islam, Buddhism. This is the Religion & Spirituality forum which is more or less the hangout for liberal theists, agnostics, atheists, new agers, new thought adherents, and the like to debate religion and spirituality-relevant topics at a more generic level. Sure, fundamentalists show up but this is not an environment that is supposed to be some sort of protected echo chamber for believers. Also, with the occasional exception of one poster (who can be caustic by C-D standards but tame by the standards here) no one has mocked or provoked the believers, simply had a discussion with them. That one poster has been dinged a couple of times for being a bit of a jackass, which is fine in the context of pre-existing guidelines.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-01-2017, 07:51 PM
An Atheist who Found God
Were you awake when you saw the light? How do you know it was the god of Christianity?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
05-01-2017, 07:53 PM
An Atheist who Found God
(29-12-2016 02:21 PM)Impulse Wrote:  and there are explanations having nothing to do with any god.


Yep, I suffer from sleep paralysis and if I didn't research it I'd think I was attacked by demons and Jesus literally saved me. So there's plenty of natural explanations.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like seongf's post
06-01-2017, 09:19 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(04-01-2017 06:47 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  
(04-01-2017 02:02 PM)Vosur Wrote:  Ha, I think there's an argument to be made that you've got it all backwards.

What?!? That was Aliza with the extra-crunchy and the cavity search gear?!? Blink

Quote:The fact that an outlandish theology can exist in the mind of an otherwise intelligent and capable person does not, in my view, speak to the merits of the theology.

Love the theist, hate the theology?

I fear that we may be agreeing here and have been talking in circles. It isn't the theology that I respect, at least not in its most basic form. It's their ability to be decent people in spite of that and be able to get along with people who clearly have radically different world views. That takes talent and class.

Quote:If anything, it speaks to that person's remarkable ability to compartmentalize.

That's certainly one aspect of it. It's also rather necessary to have devellopped a worldview that's not going to clash with reality and all of its denizens any more than you can help. You can compartmentalize Borg's childish squawking all you want, it isn't going to get any better.

Quote:I'll give you a less muddy example than KC. There's an Old Earth Creationist named Hugh Ross who happens to have a PhD in astrophysics. I watched him debate the YEC Kent Hovind a few years ago and have to admit that he comes across as a very educated, eloquent and intelligent man. Even so, he believes that Adam and Eve and the Garden of Eve existed the way it was described in Genesis. Now, would you say that this belief is 'mature and complex' simply because an intelligent man like him holds it or would you rather say that his ability to compartmentalize such an outlandish belief with everything that he knows as a scientist speaks to his highly developed intellect?

Granted, less "muddy". KC, you are a dirty, dirty dog. Get away from Aliza before QC gets the wrong idea. I'm going to have to keep you in separate rooms now aren't I? Which one of you wants to bunk with Borg and which with Q? Damn, this is going to be worse than that time with the wolf, the goat and the cabbage. Weeping

A few points:

- You've added a new aspect that I'm going to find hard to ignore and intertwined it with the core theism. Clearly I'll have a harder time respecting a biblical literalist. It isn't impossible though and there's a funny story there, though I'm not quite drunk enough to tell it.

- I'd have to say that the OEC's beliefs were a damned sight more mature than the YEC's. Less disparity with the facts, less need to compartmentalize. Still twaddle, but we're talking about a sliding scale here.

- Unlike our resident theists, cretinists have a pesky habit of peddling their beliefs in schools. The moment that Aliza petitions the Florida State School Board to give equal time for Jew Hell in math class she'll lose any respect I have for her. Actually, I'd probably split myself laughing at how she was parodying the fundamentalists and try and sign her petition.

- It isn't the intellect that's important. I know intellectuals who are jack-asses. It's a matter of being a decent person. Find me a creationist who can hang out with this lot of ruffians without flying a false flag or starting The Mother of All Flame Wars and I'll be in awe of both of you.

Quote:tl;dr version: I think you're giving credit to the belief when you should be giving credit to the believer. Tongue

I didn't see the sense in separating them. Would you still be you if I yoinked out your critical faculties and plunked some shamanism in their place?
Now that you've expanded on your position, I don't find myself disagreeing with you anymore. I don't have anything useful to add to your post. Tongue

[Image: 7oDSbD4.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-01-2017, 09:27 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(05-01-2017 11:50 AM)tomilay Wrote:  That said, we should still feel free and constrained only by reason to call out beliefs like KC's whenever we feel like on an atheist forum. I say this because some newbie impressionable atheist seeking clarification and community joins TTA, and sees KC being praised for "mature theism" and they risk falling back into their religious ways.

People do call me out... have for 5 years.

As for the bolded... that's just silly.

If anything, Aliza, Shal and I are examples that not all theists are tardmuffins, and we can interact with atheists on many different levels.

[Image: dog-shaking.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 5 users Like kingschosen's post
06-01-2017, 10:29 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(06-01-2017 09:27 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  People do call me out... have for 5 years.

It's not our fault. We were predestined to do it.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like GirlyMan's post
06-01-2017, 10:56 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(06-01-2017 09:27 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(05-01-2017 11:50 AM)tomilay Wrote:  That said, we should still feel free and constrained only by reason to call out beliefs like KC's whenever we feel like on an atheist forum. I say this because some newbie impressionable atheist seeking clarification and community joins TTA, and sees KC being praised for "mature theism" and they risk falling back into their religious ways.

People do call me out... have for 5 years.

As for the bolded... that's just silly.

If anything, Aliza, Shal and I are examples that not all theists are tardmuffins, and we can interact with atheists on many different levels.

pfft. Tardmuffin!



Big Grin
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-01-2017, 11:13 AM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
(05-01-2017 10:54 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(05-01-2017 07:37 AM)Peter Slevon Wrote:  So what are you saying, We are not even to believe facts?
Facts cannot become one's knowledge unless they are believed.

You continue to conflate two meanings of "believe". Your whole argument is muddy, even nonsensical.

Facts are accepted. That is not belief in the sense of belief without evidence.
What are the two meanings of "believe" you allege I am conflating?
Evidence:
1. There is first hand evidence.
2. Then there is evidence that someone you know has. (The person's say so.)
3. Then there is reported evidence or hear say evidence.
Each if believed becomes one's knowledge.
Item 1 there would have to be good reason not to believe it.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
06-01-2017, 04:04 PM
RE: An Atheist who Found God
I've decided I'm leaving. I don't feel welcomed here. I've feel I’ve been mocked, belittled, and derided. I shouldn’t have responded to these comments or to the invasions of my privacy and personal health as I did. I don't feel this is an atmosphere of civil, friendly debate or discussion. I'm a human being and I don't deserve to be treated this way. Thank you to the few of you who showed me some kindness. Blessings to you all.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: