Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
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20-03-2017, 10:53 AM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 10:40 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  
(20-03-2017 10:31 AM)ImFred Wrote:  You never heard of I'mFred the "5th Man" of the Gang of Four?

I thought you were up on this stuff!
Sorry to say, Fred o' pal, I haven't. Can you give me a link?

I'm actually not in this shot because I took the picture. This was back before selfies.

http://m.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazin...fied-china
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20-03-2017, 11:11 AM (This post was last modified: 20-03-2017 11:15 AM by Fred Hampton.)
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 09:41 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  
(20-03-2017 09:35 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Capitalism is THE definition of extreme. There are billionaires who rule and unpaid slaves who are ruled(owned as property)--brutally. Of course the rulers and their minions love themselves some capitalism and will defend it to the death.

Again, I said I'm not a fan of extremes, yet it seems by your words you assumed I'm a fan of capitalism?

Or did you use my point to attack capitalism, because again, I'm not a fan of extremes. Hmmm?
I'm not quite clear where you stand on Marx/Mao, or capitalism.
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20-03-2017, 11:33 AM (This post was last modified: 20-03-2017 11:54 AM by Fred Hampton.)
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 10:53 AM)ImFred Wrote:  
(20-03-2017 10:40 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Sorry to say, Fred o' pal, I haven't. Can you give me a link?

I'm actually not in this shot because I took the picture. This was back before selfies.

http://m.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazin...fied-china
Uh, rather obfuscative, IMHO, Fred.

But the article makes a very good point to counter all the USA anti-Mao/commie propaganda that Mao, was NOT, in fact, "a brutal dictator"/autocrat, but was voted in or out by the population. There were other parties in China during that time. Mao was voted out, or, more specifically, taken out by the competing more capitalist party and then returned later, voted in by his peasant/workers communist party.
Same deal in the DPRK, Cuba, etc. He was the most qualified guy BY FAR to lead their revolutionary party, but we're only talking about a couple of decades here total, and it was truly amazing what he/they accomplished in that short time. But Mao NEVER had "dictation" over all of the myriad communes during his time. He helped set overall policy, but the local communes in large part were in charge of themselves.



(Note, the music accompanying this vid is "subpar", I recommend muting it.)
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20-03-2017, 11:43 AM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
Far smaller income gaps in China, on average:


Quote:Pressure on state-owned enterprises to close the pay inequality gap has prompted China’s ruling party to take unprecedented action and cap executive pay

CORPORATE GOVERNANCE | FEATURED | HOME | STRATEGY
As part of the country’s two-year anti-corruption drive, Chinese authorities imposed an upper limit on executive pay in September and, in doing so, looked to rectify a number of employment market inefficiencies. In keeping with the ruling administration’s commitment to clamp down on state corruption and restore balance to the labour market.

...executive pay at state-owned enterprises (SOEs) will be capped at 10 times the salary of any employee at the same firm.

http://www.worldfinance.com/home/china-t...f-less-pay
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20-03-2017, 12:18 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 10:04 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  
(20-03-2017 09:55 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  I disagree with your statement that Capitalism is the definition of extreme. If we are discussing an oligarchy I'd say Communism is a much better example.
How can you disagree with the fact that in current capitalism there are billionaires, even a few trillionaires, on the high end and chatel slaves on the low end. That is factual information. Hence, capitalism is heavily oligarchic. Socialism/Communism, is, by definition, the antithesis of oligarchy. It is ther "rule of the proletariat", that is, the vast CLASS of humanity, not an autocrat or oligarchy.

You fail to acknowledge that definition =|= reality.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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20-03-2017, 12:28 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 12:18 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  
(20-03-2017 10:04 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  How can you disagree with the fact that in current capitalism there are billionaires, even a few trillionaires, on the high end and chatel slaves on the low end. That is factual information. Hence, capitalism is heavily oligarchic. Socialism/Communism, is, by definition, the antithesis of oligarchy. It is the "rule of the proletariat", that is, the vast CLASS of humanity, not an autocrat or oligarchy.

You fail to acknowledge that definition =|= reality.
Pardon me, huh???
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20-03-2017, 12:54 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
Fred

You're a believer.

The safe money is to be a hater. Hate Mao to the depths of your bone marrow. Hate him like you hate Nixon. It feels great. It feels great to breathe in the truth that there's nothing out there for us.

Shit is not delicious. It tastes like shit.
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20-03-2017, 12:56 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 11:11 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  
(20-03-2017 09:41 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Again, I said I'm not a fan of extremes, yet it seems by your words you assumed I'm a fan of capitalism?

Or did you use my point to attack capitalism, because again, I'm not a fan of extremes. Hmmm?
I'm not quite clear where you stand on Marx/Mao, or capitalism.

I'm indifferent to all.

Back in the early 80s I had the opportunity to visit a few counties in what was then Eastern Europe, I cannot say the people I met, shared food with and spoke with were overly thrilled with their lot in life. I'm also wonderful friends with a family that used to live in China, and they wouldn't say their life was great either.

I do understand with our current political flavors with "special interest groups" muddying the water with their deep pockets, campaign donations, and producing "studies" from "think tanks" that avoid the peer review process -- but I digress. No system is perfect.

I do believe education is the key to real change and it does take a lot of time. Quick changes are wrought with fears that aren't easily overcome.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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20-03-2017, 01:03 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
Quote:I do believe education is the key to real change

Educated people often use their knowledge to do shitty things.

The physicists who experimented with hydrogen bombs on The Bikini Atoll were as educated as it gets.
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20-03-2017, 01:04 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(20-03-2017 12:54 PM)ImFred Wrote:  Fred

You're a believer.

The safe money is to be a hater. Hate Mao to the depths of your bone marrow. Hate him like you hate Nixon. It feels great. It feels great to breathe in the truth that there's nothing out there for us.

Shit is not delicious. It tastes like shit.
I'm serious about the topic, but thanks for the advice, Fred.
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