Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
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13-04-2017, 04:24 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(12-04-2017 09:42 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 05:12 PM)ImFred Wrote:  Work in what way?

Is our current society "working"?

Have you been murdered?
Has your house been robbed?
Any family members kidnapped?
Do you have roads to drive on?
Do you have food readily available?
Do you have clean water?
Do you have clean air?
Do you have safe, effective medicines?
and so on.

A friend was murdered.
Twice
No
I'm forced into a using a private automobile which is an oppressor of the poor and in so many was environmentally destructive and absurdly dangerous.
It hard to afford healthy food but yes.
No
No
No
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13-04-2017, 04:28 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(12-04-2017 09:36 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 04:43 PM)Dr H Wrote:  Birth control comes to mind.

I don't believe I've "implied" anything -- what I meant to say, I said.

Pretty much all people, or at least most of them, are going to have to do this.

Yes, and they'll all do so voluntarily. Facepalm

Quote:If they do not, and if we are unable to mitigate the damage done to the planet and the species through over-population -- as seems likely -- then our species will decline, and perhaps become extinct.

You apparently don;t see your own contradiction there. There is no 'we' to do anything. You and the Libertarians are living in la-la land.

Silly old men. First we'll be unwittingly sterilized in utero by low robot doctor men in yellow hats who think they know what's best for us (and they do because we told them how to do it when it was too hard to figure out ourselves) and then they'll just genetically downselect us gradually so we won't notice it, think we're doing a good thing, saving the planet even. Clever bastards, fooling us into thinking we're being noble and shit while they go all Childhood's End on us. Makes me kind of proud. Brings a tear to me eye.

#sigh
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13-04-2017, 06:27 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(13-04-2017 04:10 PM)Dr H Wrote:  Okay, let's say your right.

Now apply that same reasoning to greenhouse gas production and global warming.

Guess we might as well not do anything about it, because not everyone seems to see the problem, much less any pressing need to do anything about it. Indeed, whole countries have opted to eschew responsibility in this particular case. For every ton of CO2 responsible Americans keep out of the atmosphere by using CFLs and LED bulbs, China puts 14 more tons of CO2 into the atmosphere from the coal-fired power plant they built to run the factory that made our CFLs and LEDs.

Guess humanity is doomed.
Well, USA (being one of the big polluters) made a deal with China (another of the big polluters) to put environmental restrictions on their industry. A mutual agreement was needed because otherwise one country would be at an economic disadvantage by imposing these restrictions.
The governments (pre-Trump) knew that collectively they need to work together to solve this global problem.

Without a government setting environmental policies, companies will pollute the atmosphere in order to make money and compete against each other. The companies don't get together and make an unwritten social contract which hampers their ability to make profit and survive as a business.
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14-04-2017, 04:14 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(13-04-2017 06:27 PM)Stevil Wrote:  Without a government setting environmental policies, companies will pollute the atmosphere in order to make money and compete against each other. The companies don't get together and make an unwritten social contract which hampers their ability to make profit and survive as a business.

Funny you should put it that way, considering that you just stated that they're polluting right now as a result of a government agreement.

--
Dr H

"So, I became an anarchist, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt."
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14-04-2017, 07:04 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(14-04-2017 04:14 PM)Dr H Wrote:  
(13-04-2017 06:27 PM)Stevil Wrote:  Without a government setting environmental policies, companies will pollute the atmosphere in order to make money and compete against each other. The companies don't get together and make an unwritten social contract which hampers their ability to make profit and survive as a business.

Funny you should put it that way, considering that you just stated that they're polluting right now as a result of a government agreement.

That is not what he said.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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14-04-2017, 07:06 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(13-04-2017 04:24 PM)ImFred Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 09:42 PM)Chas Wrote:  Have you been murdered?
Has your house been robbed?
Any family members kidnapped?
Do you have roads to drive on?
Do you have food readily available?
Do you have clean water?
Do you have clean air?
Do you have safe, effective medicines?
and so on.

A friend was murdered.
Twice
No
I'm forced into a using a private automobile which is an oppressor of the poor and in so many was environmentally destructive and absurdly dangerous.
It hard to afford healthy food but yes.
No
No
No

You don't have safe and effective medicines? Are you serious?

Your anecdotes (and Dr.H's) are not evidence of anything except this is not Utopia.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-04-2017, 06:29 PM
RE: Anarchy, Communism and Nationalism
(14-04-2017 07:06 PM)Chas Wrote:  Your anecdotes (and Dr.H's) are not evidence of anything except this is not Utopia.
What "anecdotes"?

And what are your questions evidence of, other that that you don't like the concept of anarchy (which I had pretty much already figured out)?

I posted links to a few selected examples of evidence that the system du jour isn't working so well. And there is no lack of additional examples out there, as I'm sure you know.

--
Dr H

"So, I became an anarchist, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt."
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