Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
03-01-2014, 05:51 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 04:56 PM)maklelan Wrote:  
(03-01-2014 04:15 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, science is not a religion - your definition of religion is over-broad.

So all that is needed on this website is a terse, yet authoritative "Nu-uh" to definitively shut down arguments? Coulda fooled me with the way you kept demanding I provide documentation for every little claim I made, self-evident or otherwise.

On the other hand, it's not my definition per se, it's the definition of some of the leading scholars of the sociology and psychology of religion. Care to provide something more substantive than that simple "Nu-uh"?

You did not quote my response completely. You are an intellectually dishonest dickhead.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Chas's post
03-01-2014, 05:56 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 05:02 PM)maklelan Wrote:  
(03-01-2014 04:20 PM)Chas Wrote:  Yes, when one is immersed in a religion, it involves a worldview.

When one is a human, it involves a worldview.

(03-01-2014 04:20 PM)Chas Wrote:  My quip was to point out that there is nothing actually real about a religion besides its practices.

Also false. The conceptualization of reality that spawns religious outlooks, including certain concepts of science, is a very real and very primeval cognitive faculty.

(03-01-2014 04:20 PM)Chas Wrote:  If you don't like people mocking religion you're in the wrong place.

So this place isn't about knowledge or science, or the "thinking atheist," it's a place to mock and deride religion free from the scornful eye of objectivity, insight, and respect. Gotcha.

(03-01-2014 04:20 PM)Chas Wrote:  Shrug it off, grow some balls, or find another site.

How about you actually defend your accusations instead of just evading arguments and bitching about me being here?

I have not bitched about you being here. Clearly, you did not understand what I said.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-01-2014, 08:47 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 10:42 AM)maklelan Wrote:  
(03-01-2014 09:04 AM)DLJ Wrote:  Religion

: the belief in a god or in a group of gods

Nah.

: an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods

Nah.

: an interest, a belief, or an activity that is very important to a person or group

Nah.
Interest and activity, yes... but not belief.

Science unquestionably incorporates belief, but notice it's an "or," not an "and." It certainly qualifies according to that definition, but if you think Merriam-Webster is an authoritative voice on what religion is, I've got some beachfront property I think you may be interested in. Bellah, paraphrasing Geertz (both leading scholars of the history and psychology of religion), defines religion as, "a system of symbols that, when enacted by human beings, establishes powerful, pervasive, and long-lasting moods and motivations that make sense in terms of an idea of a general order of existence." It's a cultural system. I pointed elsewhere to these scholars (and others like Boyer, Tremlin, and Guthrie), and I suggest reading them to find out how religion should and should not be defined (although to be precise and careful, complex systems like religion can never be adequately defined, they must just be described [and that's paraphrasing Barr]). Midgley's text, Evolution as a Religion, is particularly interesting in that regard.


Wow, you sure use up a lot of screen real estate to erect that stupid fucking "science is atheism's religion" straw man.Drinking Beverage

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Taqiyya Mockingbird's post
03-01-2014, 08:50 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 11:29 AM)maklelan Wrote:  
(03-01-2014 10:56 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  That seems to me more of a semantics issue.

What categories are not semantics issues?

(03-01-2014 10:56 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  To quote the great theologian Bill Maher "Atheism is a religion like abstinence is a sex position".

Cute, but remarkably naive and totally inaccurate. Belief in deity is not a defining feature of religion, as much as laypeople tend to just assume it is. People like Maher know very, very little about religion other than what trickles down to them through their socio-political interactions (which don't even scratch the surface of the global religious community).

(03-01-2014 10:56 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  The same could be said of science. It just doesn't fit the category.

Can you define the category without appealing to the horrible fallacies of dictionary semantics and Aristotelian principles of categorization? I promise you you cannot (you're welcome to try), and so you are hardly in a position to determine what does not fit the category.

(03-01-2014 10:56 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  Semantically it might especially if you're loose on the definition of religion.

What does "loose on the definition of religion" mean? Are you saying defining religion is a subjective endeavor? It's not as binary and empirical as your Maher quote presupposes? What gives?

(03-01-2014 10:56 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  With the definition above then political, economical and social systems can all be described as religion.

Yes. Certainly you acknowledge that politics can be a religion for certain groups of Americans.

(03-01-2014 10:56 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  It's been my experience that those who call science and atheism religions are merely projecting, just like those who say "I don't have enough faith to be an atheist".

So how do you respond to authors like Midgley, Bellah, and Geertz? You've obviously read them or you wouldn't be presuming to speak so authoritatively about the nature of religion and the fallacies of those who study it for a living.

"I don't believe your fucking fairy tales" is not a religion.


(03-01-2014 03:40 PM)maklelan Wrote:  In I would contend that it is in the context of the layperson's conceptualization of science that it is most commonly a religious worldview.

That is batshit crazy.



Go the fuck away.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-01-2014, 08:57 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 04:56 PM)maklelan Wrote:  
(03-01-2014 04:15 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, science is not a religion - your definition of religion is over-broad.

So all that is needed on this website is a terse, yet authoritative "Nu-uh" to definitively shut down arguments? Coulda fooled me with the way you kept demanding I provide documentation for every little claim I made, self-evident or otherwise.

On the other hand, it's not my definition per se, it's the definition of some of the leading scholars of the sociology and psychology of religion. Care to provide something more substantive than that simple "Nu-uh"?

Um, your so-called "scholars" of the sociology and psychology of religion" are equivocating and strawmanning atheists and science to pursue their own (and your) pet delusions. Their bullshit claim and 5 bucks might get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-01-2014, 09:01 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 05:02 PM)maklelan Wrote:  So this place isn't about knowledge or science, or the "thinking atheist," it's a place to mock and deride religion free from the scornful eye of objectivity, insight, and respect. Gotcha.

INCORRECT. We use precisely the tools of knowledge, science, logic, reason, objectivity and insight, plus a rigorous insistence on intellectual honesty and use of real evidence, to destroy your moronic claims.


Objectivity, insight, and respect are mental constructs and so not have eyes, scornful or otherwise.

Drinking Beverage

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
03-01-2014, 09:39 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
From the Daniel O. McClellan blog:

"Evangelizing Atheists
By Daniel O. McClellan

A couple friends on Facebook today mentioned an article on wikiHow entitled “How To Persuade a Christian To Become Atheist.” It’s a step by step guide to getting friends to question their theism without frightening them away. Apart from some errors in grammar and syntax, the article is pretty basic and logical, and emphasizes the importance of deepening one’s understanding of both sides of the issue. I’m familiar with some Christian patterns of evangelizing that utilize some of the same broad principles. Any thoughts on evangelizing atheists? Surprising? Unsurprising?"




UM, if you are here trying to "evangelize" atheists, I have a HipTip for you:



[Image: doing_it_wrong_bike.jpg]

It's Special Pleadings all the way down!


Magic Talking Snakes STFU -- revenantx77


You can't have your special pleading and eat it too. -- WillHop
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Taqiyya Mockingbird's post
03-01-2014, 10:01 PM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 09:39 PM)Taqiyya Mockingbird Wrote:  From the Daniel O. McClellan blog:

"Evangelizing Atheists
By Daniel O. McClellan

A couple friends on Facebook today mentioned an article on wikiHow entitled “How To Persuade a Christian To Become Atheist.” It’s a step by step guide to getting friends to question their theism without frightening them away. Apart from some errors in grammar and syntax, the article is pretty basic and logical, and emphasizes the importance of deepening one’s understanding of both sides of the issue. I’m familiar with some Christian patterns of evangelizing that utilize some of the same broad principles. Any thoughts on evangelizing atheists? Surprising? Unsurprising?"




UM, if you are here trying to "evangelize" atheists, I have a HipTip for you:



[Image: doing_it_wrong_bike.jpg]
I'm pretty sure that the term "evangelizing" is used as an adjective, not a verb, in that sentence. Consider

[Image: 7oDSbD4.gif]
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Vosur's post
04-01-2014, 02:00 AM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
Makes you wonder how many other great discoveries have been destroyed by the ignorant. If not for religion I'd probably be Captain Kirkin' this shit!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Drunkin Druid's post
04-01-2014, 08:26 AM
RE: Ancient Greek text laying foundations for Calculus -- Erased to make prayer book
(03-01-2014 05:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  You did not quote my response completely.

You're right. What I put in quotes was the rhetorical sense of your answer. You didn't provide an argument, you just said "Nu-uh" and then made an assertion that you didn't at all support. I never claimed to be directly quoting you, and hope you don't really think that quotation marks unilaterally assert, and bind me to the notion of, verbatim quotation.

(03-01-2014 05:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  You are an intellectually dishonest dickhead.

I see.

My Blog
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: