Animal Consciousness and Meat
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25-12-2012, 11:00 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 10:42 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(25-12-2012 10:32 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  So you're saying you're citing yourself as a source by saying through your own personal experience of being on a high carb vegan diet, that calories don't get converted into fat, and that it's is just a theory?

Seems to me as though you're just giving your opinion by using words such as 'me', and confusing opinions with what you perceive as facts. Consider
How can a literal physical reaction (or in this case non reaction) be an opinion?.

I don't know what to say to prove it? seriously - what can I do? I have some pictures here of when I wasn't eating like this if you want:

[Image: 264442_1592679555763_3289953_n.jpg]
[Image: 165851_2863232598795_690195965_n.jpg]

What else can I do? I don't know how to get through to you people- is literal picture evidence not enough? haha. If you want to read up about it check out The China Study, great book.
To further up FSM_Scot's post, the brief paragraph below may help you see the differences between fact and opinion, which you seem to have fallen prey to, unfortunately.

Facts are something that have actually happened or that are empirically true and can be supported by evidence. Opinions are a belief; they are normally subjective, meaning that they can vary based on a persons perspective, emotions or individual understanding of something. For example, biological differences between males and females are a fact, while a preference for one gender over the other is opinion.

Hope this helps.

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25-12-2012, 11:04 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 11:00 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  
(25-12-2012 10:42 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  How can a literal physical reaction (or in this case non reaction) be an opinion?.

I don't know what to say to prove it? seriously - what can I do? I have some pictures here of when I wasn't eating like this if you want:

[Image: 264442_1592679555763_3289953_n.jpg]
[Image: 165851_2863232598795_690195965_n.jpg]

What else can I do? I don't know how to get through to you people- is literal picture evidence not enough? haha. If you want to read up about it check out The China Study, great book.
To further up FSM_Scot's post, the brief paragraph below may help you see the differences between fact and opinion, which you seem to have fallen prey to, unfortunately.

Facts are something that have actually happened or that are empirically true and can be supported by evidence. Opinions are a belief; they are normally subjective, meaning that they can vary based on a persons perspective, emotions or individual understanding of something. For example, biological differences between males and females are a fact, while a preference for one gender over the other is opinion.

Hope this helps.
Don't know how to do that- if you don't believe what I say/my pictures then you should read China study or listen to the other youtubers I linked to.
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25-12-2012, 11:06 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
Nutritionists=/=government. They're not all in on a conspiracy to fuck up our health.

As for eating more, I believe it's also been shown that eating less slows your metabolism. So eating more/more often could speed it.

I've already suggested some explanations for your experiences not being universal. Tapeworms, difficulty digesting an all-plant diet, sped up metabolism from increased calorie intake. Also, you are not everybody. Hell, some people just weigh more as kids and lose it when they get older. There are a lot of variables.

Quote:How can a literal physical reaction (or in this case non reaction) be an opinion?.
Nobody is disputing your claim of weight loss. But it is your opinion that it's the direct result of not eating meat, and even moreso, that your personal experience translate directly to something everybody else should do for improved health.

And even if you're eating a high calorie diet, that doesn't mean everyone should do the same or that it will work the same way for them.

Quote:I also read in an interview than Yohan blake and Usain Bolt eats at least 15 bananas a day, with fruit as the staple, so it's not really fringe.
Yeah, he's a good example of somebody who would be burning up all the calories from that starch in the bananas. Doesn't mean sedentary people won't gain weight with a high calorie diet, or that you can only get fat from eating fat.
Quote:Don't know how to do that- if you don't believe what I say/my pictures then you should read China study or listen to the other youtubers I linked to.
I think what he wants from you is scientific evidence and peer reviewed articles, not just random youtubers.
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25-12-2012, 11:17 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 11:04 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  
(25-12-2012 11:00 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  To further up FSM_Scot's post, the brief paragraph below may help you see the differences between fact and opinion, which you seem to have fallen prey to, unfortunately.

Facts are something that have actually happened or that are empirically true and can be supported by evidence. Opinions are a belief; they are normally subjective, meaning that they can vary based on a persons perspective, emotions or individual understanding of something. For example, biological differences between males and females are a fact, while a preference for one gender over the other is opinion.

Hope this helps.
Don't know how to do that- if you don't believe what I say/my pictures then you should read China study or listen to the other youtubers I linked to.
What those in the book, and youtube, as well as yourself, are using is persuasion coupled with opinion, though I don't think yours are deliberate. Using opinionated language to persuade others of their point of view; for example, the use of "the best in the world", despite the lack of concrete evidence to support claims in an advertisement or promotion of something. When someone is considering whether the statement might be true or not, a person should consider the source of the information as well as the evidence supporting it.

Since the evidence that you, several on those youtube channels and many books out there give personal testimonies, and very little scientifically verifiable and provable evidence, credibility is out the window.

Circular reasoning isn't going to push your message further. Sources, citations and scientifically verifiable data will hold weight and crush circular reasoning.

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25-12-2012, 11:24 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 11:06 PM)amyb Wrote:  Nutritionists=/=government. They're not all in on a conspiracy to fuck up our health.

As for eating more, I believe it's also been shown that eating less slows your metabolism. So eating more/more often could speed it.

I've already suggested some explanations for your experiences not being universal. Tapeworms, difficulty digesting an all-plant diet, sped up metabolism from increased calorie intake. Also, you are not everybody. Hell, some people just weigh more as kids and lose it when they get older. There are a lot of variables.

Quote:How can a literal physical reaction (or in this case non reaction) be an opinion?.
Nobody is disputing your claim of weight loss. But it is your opinion that it's the direct result of not eating meat, and even moreso, that your personal experience translate directly to something everybody else should do for improved health.

And even if you're eating a high calorie diet, that doesn't mean everyone should do the same or that it will work the same way for them.

Quote:I also read in an interview than Yohan blake and Usain Bolt eats at least 15 bananas a day, with fruit as the staple, so it's not really fringe.
Yeah, he's a good example of somebody who would be burning up all the calories from that starch in the bananas. Doesn't mean sedentary people won't gain weight with a high calorie diet, or that you can only get fat from eating fat.
Quote:Don't know how to do that- if you don't believe what I say/my pictures then you should read China study or listen to the other youtubers I linked to.
I think what he wants from you is scientific evidence and peer reviewed articles, not just random youtubers.
I'm fairly sedentry, and I have lost weight...
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25-12-2012, 11:27 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 11:17 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  
(25-12-2012 11:04 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  Don't know how to do that- if you don't believe what I say/my pictures then you should read China study or listen to the other youtubers I linked to.
What those in the book, and youtube, as well as yourself, are using is persuasion coupled with opinion, though I don't think yours are deliberate. Using opinionated language to persuade others of their point of view; for example, the use of "the best in the world", despite the lack of concrete evidence to support claims in an advertisement or promotion of something. When someone is considering whether the statement might be true or not, a person should consider the source of the information as well as the evidence supporting it.

Since the evidence that you, several on those youtube channels and many books out there give personal testimonies, and very little scientifically verifiable and provable evidence, credibility is out the window.

Circular reasoning isn't going to push your message further. Sources, citations and scientifically verifiable data will hold weight and crush circular reasoning.
I'd like to present you with more concrete evidence, but i'm not a scientist or knows links from memory or anything about this sort of thing- I just do what works for people, and it's worked for myself- You don't have to believe me, I'm just sharing what has worked for me.
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25-12-2012, 11:38 PM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 11:27 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  I'd like to present you with more concrete evidence, but i'm not a scientist or knows links from memory or anything about this sort of thing- I just do what works for people, and it's worked for myself- You don't have to believe me, I'm just sharing what has worked for me.
... while putting forth
Quote: I don't understand why people hate on calories, all a calorie is is a measurement of energy- it doesn't get converted to fat- nor does sugar. Fat makes you fat, salt puts on water retention that looks like fat.
and
Quote: That's just a theory, me and everyone else on high carb vegan diet are tangible proof that it's not correct.
Indeed,
Quote: Most people are noobs when it comes to this stuff
and that's why it's so easy to fall for 'persuasive pudding'. Not that I hate pudding, chocolate is the best one out there in my opinion. Thumbsup

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26-12-2012, 12:02 AM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(25-12-2012 11:24 PM)FZUMedia Wrote:  I'm fairly sedentry, and I have lost weight...
You're doing it again. You =/= everybody.

You haven't even provided indisputable evidence that the diet caused the weight loss for you, must less others. And you certainly haven't shown that excess calories cannot be converted to fat. Youtube videos are not evidence. Anybody can make a youtube video and say anything. Sure, some of the people are slim and healthy looking, but it's like home gym commercials: when they cast for those commercials, they hire people who are already slim and healthy looking to convince you to buy a product. Even if they aren't selling anything, it's still trying to say "I do this, and if you do this, you'll look like me!" It's not much better than those beer commercials telling you if you drink their beer, you'll be popular with all the chicks.

Quote: and that's why it's so easy to fall for 'persuasive pudding'. Not that I
hate pudding, chocolate is the best one out there in my opinion.
I prefer vanilla.
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26-12-2012, 12:04 AM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
(26-12-2012 12:02 AM)amyb Wrote:  I prefer vanilla.

You are entitled to your opinion. Big Grin

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26-12-2012, 12:48 AM
RE: Animal Consciousness and Meat
Chocolate is good, but I actually prefer vanilla given the choice. I grew up with chocolate pudding, it's boring to me now, especially the cheap stuff.

E 2 = (mc 2)2 + (pc )2
614C → 714N + e + ̅νe
2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
It works, bitches.
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