Another High School shooter
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15-02-2018, 02:21 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
(14-02-2018 07:15 PM)Kaneda Wrote:  ...The only country I can think of that’s done this [gun control] on a massive scale is Australia, which really got serious about it around the time of the 1996 Port Arthur Shooting.

Australia hasn’t had a single "mass shooting" since the introduction of more stringent firearms legislation in 1996. We had 13 mass shootings in the 18-year period from 1979 to 1996, which would indicate that the new laws are working as planned.

Firearm suicide rates in Australia dropped by around 65% from 1997 onwards, and firearm homicides by 59% onwards.
[Andrew Leigh, Research School of Economics, Australian National University, and Christine Neill, Department of Economics, Wilfrid Laurier University Canada, 5 Aug 2012.]

And it's not just Australia that has stricter gun controls than the US. Germany, Finland, Italy, and France have more stringent ownership legislation, whilst in the UK and Japan handguns are illegal for private citizens.

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15-02-2018, 02:59 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
(15-02-2018 01:24 AM)SYZ Wrote:  
(14-02-2018 05:25 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Guns don't cause the problem.

Ask my dad.

When he went to school - all the boys brought their guns to school during hunting season. Loaded guns were in the classroom ever day. The guns were propped up on the back wall. Loaded.

This was commonplace in rural America - and there were no incidents.

It isn't the availability of guns that has changed.

Your continuing defence of unfettered personal firearm ownership and lax state licensing controls is becoming tiring mate. Your repeated argument raising straw-men such as your dad and his schoolmates taking their weapons to school last century has absolutely nothing to do with the current school massacres scenario in the US.

It's this archaic mentality that's allowed the NRA to apply political and financial pressure on members of Congress in order to defeat any positive legislative changes to firearm ownership.

And please don't whinge about your 2nd Amendment "rights" that were promulgated more than 200 years ago, and yet still allow a gun nutcase to own a personal armory of 100 weapons in a totally different 21st century society.

I've noted in the past that you invariably attempt to justify these mass shootings—just seven weeks into 2018, there have been eight shootings at US schools which have resulted in injury or death—as though each is nothing more than an isolated incident involving a single psychopathic shooter, and whose actions tighter gun control wouldn't have prevented. You say this without citing any viable evidence for this claim, other than your own personal opinion.

I was pleased however to see the phenomenon known as the "Trump Slump" reported across the firearms industry:

America’s gun manufacturers are in trouble. Sales have tumbled, leaving the companies with too much stock on their hands and falling revenues. The crunch claimed its biggest victim this week when Remington filed for bankruptcy...

In December, American Outdoor Brands—the owner of Smith & Wesson—reported that its profits had fallen 90% year over year, from $32m to just $3.2m. Sales have fallen 36%...

In October 2017, Sturm Ruger, the largest firearm manufacturer in the US, announced its quarterly revenues had fallen 35%.

—This would indicate that, at last, Americans aren't exactly rushing to buy new weapons, although with the US having the highest rate of gun ownership in the world with 88 guns for every 100 people, and just 3% of the population owns an average of 17 guns each, it's only a tiny flame of hope. There are still an estimated 7.7 million "super-owners" in possession of between eight and 140 guns apiece.

I defy Onlinebiker to justify the ownership of 140 firearms for any single individual—other than licensed gun shops and/or registered historical collectors. I've only ever owned three firearms at the one time; a heavy barrel Anschütz target shooter, a 10/22 Ruger bunny gun (for feral dogs), and a single Ruger .22 competition pistol. Note that I can only use the handgun on a registered shooting range, and under the auspices of a club, and I can only conceal carry to or from a range.

—Why could not the latter handgun restriction apply in the US for club-registered shooters?

Real simple " mate".

We don't care what you do in Australia.

We don't tell you what to do.

We don't need you to tell us what to do.

..

Any questions?

....

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15-02-2018, 05:00 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
And there we have it, the real problem here.
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15-02-2018, 05:36 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
Jim Jefferies, an Australian comedian, on gun control':

Quote:In Australia, we had guns, right? Right up until 1996.

In 1996, Australia had the biggest massacre on Earth. It still hasn’t been beaten. And… Now, after that, they banned the guns. Now, in the 10 years before Port Arthur, there was 10 massacres. Since the gun ban in 1996, there hasn’t been a single massacre since. I don’t know how or why this happened, uh… Maybe it was a coincidence, right?

Now, please understand that I understand that Australia and America are two vastly different cultures with different people, right? I get it.

In Australia, we had the biggest massacre on Earth, and the Australian government went, “That’s it! No more guns!” And we all went, “Yeah, all right, then. That seems fair enough, really.”

Now, in America, you had the Sandy Hook massacre where little, tiny children died, and your government went, “Maybe… we’ll get rid of the big guns?” And 50% of you went, “Fuck you! Don’t take my guns!”

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15-02-2018, 05:42 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
(15-02-2018 05:36 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  Jim Jefferies, an Australian comedian, on gun control':

Quote:In Australia, we had guns, right? Right up until 1996.

In 1996, Australia had the biggest massacre on Earth. It still hasn’t been beaten. And… Now, after that, they banned the guns. Now, in the 10 years before Port Arthur, there was 10 massacres. Since the gun ban in 1996, there hasn’t been a single massacre since. I don’t know how or why this happened, uh… Maybe it was a coincidence, right?

Now, please understand that I understand that Australia and America are two vastly different cultures with different people, right? I get it.

In Australia, we had the biggest massacre on Earth, and the Australian government went, “That’s it! No more guns!” And we all went, “Yeah, all right, then. That seems fair enough, really.”

Now, in America, you had the Sandy Hook massacre where little, tiny children died, and your government went, “Maybe… we’ll get rid of the big guns?” And 50% of you went, “Fuck you! Don’t take my guns!”
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016.../90858752/
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15-02-2018, 05:47 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
(15-02-2018 05:42 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016.../90858752/

3% of Americans own half the country's 265 million guns

That is INSANE. I can only imagine some peoples houses looking like a bloody army artillery store of some kind.

That being said, from what I see on UK TV (so I imagine not the full scope of it at all), a lot of Americans who are "pro-guns" may not have guns, but are more bothered that their RIGHT to have gun could be infringed? I know there is a lot of stuff to do with the NRA and who may or may not be being paid by them to vote pro-gun laws in the senate etc, but Gun Laws, and a lot of other laws that get voted on, seem to come down to "well I should have the RIGHT to do X if I wanted to".

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15-02-2018, 06:02 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
(15-02-2018 05:47 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  
(15-02-2018 05:42 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2016.../90858752/

3% of Americans own half the country's 265 million guns

That is INSANE. I can only imagine some peoples houses looking like a bloody army artillery store of some kind.

That being said, from what I see on UK TV (so I imagine not the full scope of it at all), a lot of Americans who are "pro-guns" may not have guns, but are more bothered that their RIGHT to have gun could be infringed? I know there is a lot of stuff to do with the NRA and who may or may not be being paid by them to vote pro-gun laws in the senate etc, but Gun Laws, and a lot of other laws that get voted on, seem to come down to "well I should have the RIGHT to do X if I wanted to".
And most people aren't in favor of taking all guns. I've been an owner and shooters since 1965 and I think guns have a place. Twice a year I go on coyote thinning hunts, they're an invasive species and can damage a local ecosystem the same way they did Yellowstone.

I also have cousins who own an average of 50 guns each. They live in box canyons out in the sticks and refuse to allow the roads to their homes to be paved. You wouldn't know their drive from a livestock track. The family tree back there gets very vertical.
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15-02-2018, 06:36 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
The people I worry the least about are the people who constitute "gun nuts".
In my experience those people aren't going to shoot anybody. Unless someone climbs through a window in their house.

It's the guy who goes to Walmart to buy his first gun.
Or buys it illegally.

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15-02-2018, 06:43 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
(15-02-2018 06:36 AM)BikerDude Wrote:  The people I worry the least about are the people who constitute "gun nuts".

Come meet my cousins. The "Big Fifty" have 1,500+ guns between them. They're pathological and psychotic. Please wear a Go-Pro, they'll let me have it.
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15-02-2018, 07:31 AM
RE: Another High School shooter
46 days into 2018:

[Image: 7q055aZ.jpg]

Things are so desensitized that my local paper this morning, Freedom From Religion Foundation wanting a public school classroom plastered with Bible verses and crosses to remove the religious influence, is the bigger above page headline than the murder of 17 people in a school. (More now; that coach who shielded his students with his body, died overnight.)

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