Another attack on moral subjectivism
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26-06-2015, 03:57 PM
RE: Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 03:56 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:53 PM)tear151 Wrote:  well i wouldnt, weve reached a stalemate.

You wouldn't what?

i dont accept that as a definition of morality.

"A witty quote means nothing"
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26-06-2015, 03:58 PM
Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 03:57 PM)tear151 Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:56 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  You wouldn't what?

i dont accept that as a definition of morality.

Accept what as a definition of morality? That it is an altruistic-like behavior derived from society?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-06-2015, 03:59 PM
Another attack on moral subjectivism
If not, why?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-06-2015, 03:59 PM
Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 03:46 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:42 PM)Stevil Wrote:  How do you derive morality from society?
Does it come to a majority vote? Or is it decided by those in power? Or is there some other way?

Does this mean that if a person deems it immoral to eat meat therefore becomes a vegitarian and if society deems it a moral to eat meat then this vegitarian is demonstrably wrong and should therefore eat meat?

No, what he means is that without society, morality is a meaningless concept.

Even with society morality here seems to be an incoherent concept. Those arguing against moral nihilism, are doing a lousy job of it. TBD who defines morality along the lines of behavior, can't even clarify if he means how they ought to behave or if he's merely making an observation of how they do in fact behave.

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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26-06-2015, 03:59 PM
RE: Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 03:53 PM)Stevil Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:48 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  This is the entire process of the social contract idea. And it doesn't only work on "right or wrong" principals or ideas. It's just as equally into harmful, fairness, sacred, tradition, purity, and such things.

Is it okay to discriminate upon gays?
If the social contract idea tries to answer questions such as "Is it okay to..."
Then the social contract idea is fundamentally flawed.

If we are defining law then the question is "Is society unsafe if we allow ..."
Whether something is OK or not is up to the individual to decide for themself, its not for government to dictate.

If it's okay, or is it harmful to? is it more fair too? Is it a violation of freedom to? are the questions that are morally arisen in people and the population.

It's all a social moment because these "morals" or in some cases laws, come largely based upon what the majorities of these individuals felt. Individuals collect and form groups... that's how it becomes a social society value. And no longer just some individuals whim.

History these days even shows the so called "backwoods" or out in the mountains away from cities weren't exactly poorer than city folks or sent away. Plenty of people because they didn't agree with those social moral views choose to have their own societies outside that realm. It's something that's still a desire for some groups these days like Glenn Beck. They want a area of their values where they have some differences are more prominent

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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26-06-2015, 04:00 PM
RE: Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 03:58 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:57 PM)tear151 Wrote:  i dont accept that as a definition of morality.

Accept what as a definition of morality? That it is an altruistic-like behavior derived from society?

i hold the normative definition, if an action is moral, im obligated to do it.

"A witty quote means nothing"
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26-06-2015, 04:01 PM
Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 03:58 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:57 PM)tear151 Wrote:  i dont accept that as a definition of morality.

Accept what as a definition of morality? That it is an altruistic-like behavior derived from society?

Is it a behavior or a preference for altruistic-like behaviors? That leads us to value such behaviors as good, and non-altruistic like behaviors as bad?

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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26-06-2015, 04:01 PM
Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 04:00 PM)tear151 Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:58 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Accept what as a definition of morality? That it is an altruistic-like behavior derived from society?

i hold the normative definition, if an action is moral, im obligated to do it.

Then how is morality an individual concept? Who are you obligated to?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-06-2015, 04:03 PM
Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 04:01 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 03:58 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Accept what as a definition of morality? That it is an altruistic-like behavior derived from society?

Is it a behavior or a preference for altruistic-like behaviors? That leads us to value such behaviors as good, and non-altruistic like behaviors as bad?

Why are you still asking questions when you don't want answers?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-06-2015, 04:03 PM
RE: Another attack on moral subjectivism
(26-06-2015 04:01 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(26-06-2015 04:00 PM)tear151 Wrote:  i hold the normative definition, if an action is moral, im obligated to do it.

Then how is morality an individual concept? Who are you obligated to?

i said im a moral nihilist, i reject the idea.

"A witty quote means nothing"
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