Another way to look at evolution
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16-04-2013, 11:37 PM
Another way to look at evolution
I've been thinking about it. And I realize that evolution is an apolitical, amoral, areligious, and inevitable byproduct of a few basic rules of chemistry, physics and mathematical probability. Discuss

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17-04-2013, 04:36 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
(16-04-2013 11:37 PM)Carlo_The_Bugsmasher_Driver Wrote:  I've been thinking about it. And I realize that evolution is an apolitical, amoral, areligious, and inevitable byproduct of a few basic rules of chemistry, physics and mathematical probability. Discuss


I don't know what you mean by 'another'. Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-04-2013, 04:51 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
"Another" as in "Evolution is the tool of Satan."
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17-04-2013, 04:52 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
BTW, I ran this by PZed and he liked it. "Calling modern evolutionary theory 'Darwinism' is like calling modern aeronautical engineering 'Wrightism'."
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17-04-2013, 08:15 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
(17-04-2013 04:36 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(16-04-2013 11:37 PM)Carlo_The_Bugsmasher_Driver Wrote:  I've been thinking about it. And I realize that evolution is an apolitical, amoral, areligious, and inevitable byproduct of a few basic rules of chemistry, physics and mathematical probability. Discuss


I don't know what you mean by 'another'. Consider
/thread.

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17-04-2013, 09:52 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
Hey, Gawd.

Darwinism is a term used by radical Evangelicals like Richard Dawkins and... wait... what...

Hey, Carlo.

I disagree.

It's not the result of chemistry.

Most people conflate two terms: DNA and gene.

DNA is a molecule. It is a semiochemical: a chemical that carries a message.

A gene is information. It is most ubiquitously stored IN DNA, but it can be stored anywhere information can be stored and transmitted any way information can be transmitted.

Shakespeare's sonnets were recently stored in DNA, a fascinating experiment that illustrates handily that DNA's "job" is not to store genes, but to store information of any kind.

All of this is to say that evolution isn't an inevitability of chemistry. It might be an inevitability of physics because physics covers information transfer. As for mathematical probability, sure. Why not.

Blackmore attributed this to Dennett. IF you have VARIATION and HEREDITY and SELECTION, THEN you MUST have evolution.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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17-04-2013, 10:07 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
(17-04-2013 09:52 AM)Ghost Wrote:  Hey, Gawd.

Darwinism is a term used by radical Evangelicals like Richard Dawkins and... wait... what...

Hey, Carlo.

I disagree.

It's not the result of chemistry.

Most people conflate two terms: DNA and gene.

DNA is a molecule. It is a semiochemical: a chemical that carries a message.

A gene is information. It is most ubiquitously stored IN DNA, but it can be stored anywhere information can be stored and transmitted any way information can be transmitted.

Shakespeare's sonnets were recently stored in DNA, a fascinating experiment that illustrates handily that DNA's "job" is not to store genes, but to store information of any kind.

All of this is to say that evolution isn't an inevitability of chemistry. It might be an inevitability of physics because physics covers information transfer. As for mathematical probability, sure. Why not.

Blackmore attributed this to Dennett. IF you have VARIATION and HEREDITY and SELECTION, THEN you MUST have evolution.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt

Here, on earth, it is RNA/DNA-based. It is a result of physics/chemistry. Once there is replication and change, there is evolution.

This is the 'evolution' that is apolitical, amoral, and areligious here on earth.

It is the opposition to the fact of biological evolution that is political, moral, and religious.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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17-04-2013, 10:23 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
Epic rap battle: Chas vs Ghost. Thumbsup

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17-04-2013, 10:34 AM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
Hey, Chas.

I actually have no idea what your counterargument is. Like really. What's all this "here on Earth" business?

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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17-04-2013, 12:00 PM
RE: Another way to look at evolution
You're arguing past each other.


Life is based on chemistry, and that chemistry interacts in a way that can be described as carrying information. Evolution works upon groups of organisms and the physical characteristics expressed due to the information expressed in their chemistry.

You're saying the same thing, but from two different conceptual levels. Chas is talking the chemistry level, Ghost is talking the informational level. Both are valid and essential to our understanding of biological evolution.

E 2 = (mc 2)2 + (pc )2
614C → 714N + e + ̅νe
2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
It works, bitches.
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