Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
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11-09-2014, 04:23 PM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
I have posted my feelings on this issue before. I'm about equality for all, and by equality for all, I mean equality in every situation. I don't speak out against inequality in one situation and then condone it in the next. I don't feel that certain people deserve a free pass. We atheists are all quite sick of the free pass that religious people have gotten for so long, and at the same time you have people like Rebecca Watson, who is incredibly anti-male, talking about how atheists need to follow her line of thinking.

I posted this in a previous thread:

If feminism is about equality, then why have feminists never spoken out about the situations where men are getting the short end of the stick?

Women serve 50% less jail time than men for the same crimes.

Parental rights are so ridiculously in favor of women that fathers have hardly any rights when it comes to their children. Our society treats them as though their only role is a financial one. If a man and his wife get divorced, the message is "Just pay your child support, and we really don't give a shit if you're part of the life of your child!" I have seen several cases where people have gone through a nasty divorce and the woman kept the dad from seeing his children with little to no action on the part of the courts.

There have been cases of men being jailed for not paying child support FOR KIDS THAT ARE NOT EVEN THEIRS! In fact, there was a man who was still paying child support for a kid that was not his, and could not pay it anymore because he lost his job. You know what happened? He was thrown in jail!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drI1YdbTSx8

How many feminist groups spoke out about that? ZERO!

Sharon Osbourne made fun of a guy who was drugged by his wife and then castrated, and the wife then threw his penis down the garbage disposal. Guess what the repercussions were? ZERO! Guess how many feminist groups stood up and said "This is wrong! She should be fired!"? ZERO! We all know that if the situation were turned around and a man on a talk show laughed and made fun of a woman who had her tits cut off and cut her clitoris cut out by her husband, and he threw those down a garbage disposal, every feminist out there would have been screaming bloody murder.

If you're familiar with The Amazing Atheist and his You Tube channel, he has made some good videos addressing this point:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqU9JFbt...31FBAB4EAE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JA4EPRbWhQ

Thunderf00t, another well-known atheist with a You Tube channel, has also called out the whole atheism+ crowd, and its members like feminist man-hater Rebecca Watson, on their blatant hypocrisy.

If feminists want me to believe that they are about equality between men and women, then they need to start proving it, and addressing issues where women have an unfair advantage over men. So far as I can tell, feminists are about female superiority, not equality. A lack of action against inequality says a lot for a group of people who claim to be about equality for all.

Of course, mentioning this also makes me a misogynist in the eyes of a large number of feminists (the feminists who don't take the hateful approach will simply sit by and watch those feminists lambaste a man for saying what I did and just keep their mouths shut), because they are supposed to be beyond criticism. Hmmm...that line of thinking sounds oddly familiar. How is it any different than creationists bitching when I criticize religion and speak up about the fact that it is not fair that theists are allowed to openly criticize and even preach hatred about atheists, while atheists are supposed to just keep their mouth shut, because society says that if atheists call out theists on their hypocrisy they are just being hateful assholes?

I don't believe in free passes for anyone, and if you feel that women deserve a free pass when behaving like Sharon Osbourne did, then you're just as hypocritical as the religious person that whines about being called out on their hypocrisy.

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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11-09-2014, 11:52 PM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(06-09-2014 04:19 PM)Antonis Wrote:  Personally i have nothing against feminism and i don't think that 'feminism poisons everyhing' but i believe the world don't need it anymore. It was very good and usefull in the 70s when women really have serious problems like less pay for the same work and no vote rights. Egalitarianism is they way now to make the world better. The only thing today feminists do is hating on things like the fact that video games are sexist because they make women be sex objects with big tits.

Because in a world where entire regimes enforce abuse towards women for not covering there hair

[Image: 2013829223618432734_20.jpg]

feminism is just obsolete.

Because in a world where women are paid less for equal work

[Image: US_gender_pay_gap,_by_sex,_race-ethnicity.001.png]

feminism is just obsolete.

Because in a world where women are raped and are not granted justice

[Image: rape-statistics.jpg]
[Image: hindustan-times-e-paper-2012-12-23-17-29-59.png]

feminism is just obsolete.

Can you see the pattern? Drinking Beverage

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12-09-2014, 12:09 AM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(11-09-2014 04:23 PM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  If feminism is about equality, then why have feminists never spoken out about the situations where men are getting the short end of the stick?
... Well you certainly seem to be speaking out! You GO lil' seeker-of-equality-for-all. Drinking Beverage Perhaps, and this is just a guess, perhaps people who're heavily involved with one issue don't have *all the time in the world* to care about other issues. Like, should anti-racism groups be involved in "situations where men get the short end of the stick"? No? That's *not their focus*. You are perfectly free to start your own group with it's own focus.

Fuck sakes it's like talking to a wall. Feminism *is* about equality, but is it *too* much, to ask that they be permitted to *focus* on women's rights? Christ Rolleyes

Feminists: "Er... society treats women really badly"
Critics: "But look at all the situations where men get treated badly, what are you doing about those"...

W. T. F. ?

Quote:I don't believe in free passes for anyone, and if you feel that women deserve a free pass when behaving like Sharon Osbourne did, then you're just as hypocritical as the religious person that whines about being called out on their hypocrisy.
Nice strawman kid. You actually *ask* any feminist group what they thought about this?

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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12-09-2014, 06:45 AM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
For all these feminism threads::

For any philosophy, politics, religion, or movement there is a spectrum of opinion, commitment, and focus from "that's interesting" to "kill the infidels".

Please stop conflating extremists and moderates, it makes you appear shallow and thoughtless - even irrational..

If you think feminism is exclusionary, outdated, no longer useful, then you are not paying attention to reality.
If you are painting feminism as a whole with the brush of misandry, you are being shallow and ignorant.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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12-09-2014, 08:28 AM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(12-09-2014 06:45 AM)Chas Wrote:  For all these feminism threads::

For any philosophy, politics, religion, or movement there is a spectrum of opinion, commitment, and focus from "that's interesting" to "kill the infidels".

Please stop conflating extremists and moderates, it makes you appear shallow and thoughtless - even irrational..

If you think feminism is exclusionary, outdated, no longer useful, then you are not paying attention to reality.
If you are painting feminism as a whole with the brush of misandry, you are being shallow and ignorant.

BUT CHAS ONCE UPON A TIME THERE WAS A CRAZY PERSON ON TUMBLR THEREFORE FEMINAZI REPTILOID SOCIAL JUSTICE FASCIST CULTURAL MARXIST MISANDRIC CONSPIRACY QED

WAKE UP SHEEPLE

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12-09-2014, 09:39 AM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(12-09-2014 08:28 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(12-09-2014 06:45 AM)Chas Wrote:  For all these feminism threads::

For any philosophy, politics, religion, or movement there is a spectrum of opinion, commitment, and focus from "that's interesting" to "kill the infidels".

Please stop conflating extremists and moderates, it makes you appear shallow and thoughtless - even irrational..

If you think feminism is exclusionary, outdated, no longer useful, then you are not paying attention to reality.
If you are painting feminism as a whole with the brush of misandry, you are being shallow and ignorant.

BUT CHAS ONCE UPON A TIME THERE WAS A CRAZY PERSON ON TUMBLR THEREFORE FEMINAZI REPTILOID SOCIAL JUSTICE FASCIST CULTURAL MARXIST MISANDRIC CONSPIRACY QED

WAKE UP SHEEPLE

Well, yeah, there's that. Yes

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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12-09-2014, 12:39 PM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(12-09-2014 12:09 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(11-09-2014 04:23 PM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  If feminism is about equality, then why have feminists never spoken out about the situations where men are getting the short end of the stick?
... Well you certainly seem to be speaking out! You GO lil' seeker-of-equality-for-all. Drinking Beverage Perhaps, and this is just a guess, perhaps people who're heavily involved with one issue don't have *all the time in the world* to care about other issues. Like, should anti-racism groups be involved in "situations where men get the short end of the stick"? No? That's *not their focus*. You are perfectly free to start your own group with it's own focus.

Fuck sakes it's like talking to a wall. Feminism *is* about equality, but is it *too* much, to ask that they be permitted to *focus* on women's rights? Christ Rolleyes

Feminists: "Er... society treats women really badly"
Critics: "But look at all the situations where men get treated badly, what are you doing about those"...

W. T. F. ?

Quote:I don't believe in free passes for anyone, and if you feel that women deserve a free pass when behaving like Sharon Osbourne did, then you're just as hypocritical as the religious person that whines about being called out on their hypocrisy.
Nice strawman kid. You actually *ask* any feminist group what they thought about this?

So when I criticized how a Chicago preacher who constantly preaches hatred on the street got attacked and was portrayed by the media as some innocent victim who just preaches God's word gets his hateful behavior ignored, and say that it's a double standard that a person who preaches hate against others for religious reasons gets a free pass like that, is no different than preaching hatred for reasons of prejudice against other cultures, then that's not a strawman. I say that women like Sharon Osbourne should not get a free pass when making fun of a man on national television who was castrated by his wife for wanting a divorce, while if it were the other way around and a man cut off his wife's breasts, and a man on a talk show laughed about it, that he would be lambasted and kicked off that show in the blink of an eye, is a double standard, then I'm creating a strawman. Yeah, that's not a double standard at all. Drinking Beverage

A lack of inaction says speaks just as much. I'm not painting all feminists this way, but if someone is going to say that they fight for equality for all, yet turn a blind eye when women are doing things that they'd be flipping out about if a man did the same to a woman, then they are being hypocritical. What do you think of like Karen Straughan, who speaks out about this double standard, and a lack of action on the parts of feminists when these things happen? Is she just creating strawman arguments as well?

“Religion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.” - Mark Twain
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12-09-2014, 03:22 PM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(12-09-2014 12:39 PM)WindyCityJazz Wrote:  So when I criticized how a Chicago preacher who constantly preaches hatred on the street got attacked and was portrayed by the media as some innocent victim who just preaches God's word gets his hateful behavior ignored, and say that it's a double standard that a person who preaches hate against others for religious reasons gets a free pass like that, is no different than preaching hatred for reasons of prejudice against other cultures, then that's not a strawman. I say that women like Sharon Osbourne should not get a free pass when making fun of a man on national television who was castrated by his wife for wanting a divorce, while if it were the other way around and a man cut off his wife's breasts, and a man on a talk show laughed about it, that he would be lambasted and kicked off that show in the blink of an eye, is a double standard, then I'm creating a strawman. Yeah, that's not a double standard at all. Drinking Beverage
You implied that those who disagreed with you must by default think that the Osborne incident was perfectly OK. I note you haven't actually supplied a name of any feminist who's actually supporting this so yeah, strawman.

Quote:A lack of inaction says speaks just as much. I'm not painting all feminists this way, but if someone is going to say that they fight for equality for all, yet turn a blind eye when women are doing things that they'd be flipping out about if a man did the same to a woman, then they are being hypocritical. What do you think of like Karen Straughan, who speaks out about this double standard, and a lack of action on the parts of feminists when these things happen? Is she just creating strawman arguments as well?
If she does it as crappily as you do, then yeah Drinking Beverage

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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12-09-2014, 04:09 PM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
I'm going to respond to the op rather than read through 20+ pages of angry posts. I don't have a problem with women fighting for equality, women are people first and foremost and should not be treated like a life support system for a vagina. I, personally, don't agree 100% with Anita but she makes enough points that I actually listened to a lot of what she said. I do have an issue with radicalism because that only serves to alienate the thing you are fighting for. I have yet to meet anyone claiming to be a feminist that feels like I metaphorically raped her because I have a penis. Do they exist? Possibly, I haven't met all feminists. I don't think anything will be perfectly equal as long as things are run by people because we are all humans, and not perfect. The important thing we need to do is do what we can to help each other get as close as we can. My personal thoughts.
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12-09-2014, 04:31 PM
RE: Anti-Feminism is poisoning atheism
(12-09-2014 04:09 PM)Woefatt Wrote:  I'm going to respond to the op rather than read through 20+ pages of angry posts. I don't have a problem with women fighting for equality, women are people first and foremost and should not be treated like a life support system for a vagina. I, personally, don't agree 100% with Anita but she makes enough points that I actually listened to a lot of what she said. I do have an issue with radicalism because that only serves to alienate the thing you are fighting for. I have yet to meet anyone claiming to be a feminist that feels like I metaphorically raped her because I have a penis. Do they exist? Possibly, I haven't met all feminists. I don't think anything will be perfectly equal as long as things are run by people because we are all humans, and not perfect. The important thing we need to do is do what we can to help each other get as close as we can. My personal thoughts.

Nice post

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