Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
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27-12-2013, 07:06 PM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
(27-12-2013 06:59 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(27-12-2013 06:22 PM)Takelababy Wrote:  I have learned that it is best to be humble and not impose arguments for my lack of belief on anyone. Otherwise it puts me in the same category as those who try to impose their religious beliefs on others.

No, it won't. The two positions are not equivalent.

You've got me thinking and I do agree. The two positions are not equivalent. However, from the perspective of the recipient of the proselytizing it does come across as the same. Although we as enlightened followers of science know better.

"Which is more likely: that the whole natural order is suspended, or that a jewish minx should tell a lie?"- David Hume
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27-12-2013, 10:23 PM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
I consider myself anti-theist not anti-theocrat. I vehemently despise the dogmas of religion and feel ethically compelled as a participant in the world to actively and openly contest any point of view that has a direct or indirect impact on my life. My view cannot be classed as equal to a religious view as I can use evidence as a tool. In this day and age faith/religion are not only held with a lack of evidence but inspite of it.

Note I am attaching the points of view and not the person holding it. There is a difference but those views in public, social and political forums inform the views and decisions of many people on subjects like:-

Sexuality
Abortion
Rape
Marriage
Tax Breaks
Science education
History education
Racism
Tribalism
Terrorism
Straight up murder
Misogyny
Genital mutilation
Morality
... ...
The list goes on forever. I despise theism (supernatural beliefs INSPITE of evidence) unjustifiably impacting the society I live in. As I've said it's the ideas I attack not the person. If in discussion they take it to heart that's something they may need to take a look at for themselves Smile

A man blames his bad childhood on leprechauns. He claims they don't exist, but yet still says without a doubt that they stole all his money and then killed his parents. That's why he became Leprechaun-Man

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28-12-2013, 11:22 AM (This post was last modified: 28-12-2013 11:27 AM by Lucid Moments.)
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
Hmm. I agree with some and disagree with some. I agree that when people with religious views try to force them on others that they need to be stopped.

I disagree that I need to convince people that hold personal beliefs, no matter how ridiculous they may be, that their beliefs are wrong. As long as they don't harm me with them.

That is unfortunately not a simple distinction to make because people who hold personal beliefs tend to act on them. They vote, they raise children. They influence the world around them in a host of ways.
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29-12-2013, 11:14 AM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
I've considered myself to be an atheist for less than a year. I've also noticed the wide range of opinions that atheists hold in regards to religions.

I experienced indoctrination as a child. I grew up in one of the worst kinds of fundamentalist churches. They were anti-science, anti-evolution, anti-catholic, and anti-denomination. I asked my dad recently how old he believed the universe to be. His answer? 12,000 years old. The church also has very specific ideas about women's roles.

I've been attending various various atheist and free-thinker groups I found on meetup.com. I find I have little in common with anti-theist groups. I'm also a humanist and wouldn't have a problem working together with theists toward some humanist goal.

I do however, enjoy debating God's existence with theists online. I've had one or two conversations with people in real life regarding evidence for God's existence, but found them to be disappointing.

If it were up to me religions would be a thing of the past. Perhaps if religions could just admit that their deity is just a man-made mythology, we could live together in peace. I have no problems pointing out the problems that religions cause, but I do it online, rarely in real-life.

Religions have their flaws, that is obvious, but we must remember that all man-made organizations have their flaws.
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08-01-2014, 10:00 AM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
(27-12-2013 05:42 PM)Adrianime Wrote:  Is it better to leave her as a happy wife caught in the illusion that she has a perfect faithful husband? Or is it better to show her the reality that her husband is in fact cheating on her, and isn't what he seems?

This is a great analogy (I know this is off topic). I've been trying to explain to my father what religion does to him. This is perfect, thank you very much.

Atir aissom atir imon
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08-01-2014, 10:47 AM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
Thumbsup

I prefer fantasy, but I have to live in reality.
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08-01-2014, 11:27 AM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
Just as one chooses thier religious alliance mostly based on where they live and what is exposed to them, the christian bible will be under fire from non-believers in the US since it is propped up and promoted everywhere as "the way". In my neck of the woods, it is easiest to go after as most knowledge is here on both sides of the coin. If I lived elswhere, then my primary beef may be with another faith, but I stand against all worship woo-woo among all humans.

I have to say that I see myself becoming more militant in my views on theism and need to rachet the sensitivity on my BS meter down to more tolerable levels. I am athiest and anti-religion I guess. Provides more damage and deception than any real good purpose IMO.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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08-01-2014, 11:34 AM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
(27-12-2013 05:11 PM)Lucid Moments Wrote:  I have recently converted to atheism, and have only very recently begun doing much reading on the subject and have come across something that makes me curious.

A lot of what I see discussed seems to be directed at Christians in an apparent attempt to convert them, or to disprove Christianity. And I wonder why that is. Don't get me wrong. I live in Northeast Georgia so I am very well aware of how obnoxious some so-called Christians can be with their efforts to force their religion on me, but as long as they don't try to use the government to do it then while it annoys me it doesn't particularly concern me. They have the rights of free speech and freedom of religion just like I do.

Maybe it is because I have not yet had an experience where someone has had an issue with me being an atheist that I don't feel the need to push back. Maybe I am just too laid back for my own good. I don't know.

Any thoughts, opinions or random musings are welcome.

I never try to deconvert any religious person.

In fact the the only thing that I actively fight against is the intrusion of religious pseudoscience into society claiming to be science.

As well as people who try to undermine the seperation of religion and state.

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08-01-2014, 03:33 PM
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
I despise religions. Here are a couple of my reasons;

1)Sick kids dying while their parents are waiting for a prayer to be answered.

2)During difficult economic times, the faithful will scrape together a little money to give offering to a guy or gal that is reading them fairy tales. That money could scrounge up some kind of meager meal. That would be something tangible instead of giving an offering and then sitting around hoping that god finally recognizes your devotion and gives you a return on your generosity.

I find Christianity to be an additional/optional economic chain on the poor and working class in this country, that really takes advantage of their desperation. It is pathetic.

I am not worried about the Christians In Name Only:CINOs, I am concerned about the apologists and the people trying to increase the reach of religion's claws into the flesh of the world. Weeping

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08-01-2014, 05:29 PM (This post was last modified: 08-01-2014 05:41 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Anti-Religeon vs. Atheism
I generally only play the "atheist" card when I don't want to argue metaphysics with some delusional dimwit. My own personal metaphysics are more subtle than that what with me being my own personal Jesus and shit. I don't need to believe in God in order to find value in the teachings of Jesus or any other Bodhisattva for that matter. No reason to corrupt The Word with religion. And I'm areligious instead of anti-religion for similar reasons. Religion just ain't worth my time. I can do this all by myself.

But that's just me. I realize that the anti-theists are providing a worthwhile service to humanity, it just ain't for Girly.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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