Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
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25-06-2011, 05:46 PM
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
The only suggestion I had was the title but that has already been brought up by other people, I do think they are definitely right though. I especially like Liliths suggestion.

I am not going to attempt to offer any constructive criticism on the writing style as I don't feel I know enough about it to comment and I'm not even going to read what you've put as I have read something you have put before and I found it very good, at that point I decided that I would get most enjoyment by waiting for the book to be released and reading it as a whole. As such I have been restraining myself from reading any more for now, difficult as it has been.

Good luck with the book, I hope it is a success, I can guarantee you at least one sale Smile

I'm sorry I couldn't be of more assistance but I'm sure the more literary minded people on the forum will be more than adequate in that respect.

Best and worst of Ferdinand .....
Best
Ferdinand: We don't really say 'theist' in Alabama. Here, you're either a Christian, or you're from Afghanistan and we fucking hate you.
Worst
Ferdinand: Everyone from British is so, like, fucking retarded.
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25-06-2011, 11:22 PM
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
(25-06-2011 05:46 PM)Hughsie Wrote:  The only suggestion I had was the title but that has already been brought up by other people, I do think they are definitely right though. I especially like Liliths suggestion.

I am not going to attempt to offer any constructive criticism on the writing style as I don't feel I know enough about it to comment and I'm not even going to read what you've put as I have read something you have put before and I found it very good, at that point I decided that I would get most enjoyment by waiting for the book to be released and reading it as a whole. As such I have been restraining myself from reading any more for now, difficult as it has been.

Good luck with the book, I hope it is a success, I can guarantee you at least one sale Smile

I'm sorry I couldn't be of more assistance but I'm sure the more literary minded people on the forum will be more than adequate in that respect.

Hi Hughsie, thankyou! That is very nice of you to say you will buy a copy. You won't though, you will get a free one once it is finished LOL. As I said, I'm not here to promote sales. Nor am I here to get a free edit either in the sense of sentence structure, grammar etc. If someone happens to point specific errors like that out, I'm grateful, but I'm mainly interested in generally just what people think. For example..."that section was too boring/irrelevant/plainly wrong/ factually incorrect OR fantastic/eye opening/hit the spot etc etc.
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26-06-2011, 01:49 AM
 
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
Just a note saying that churches have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. I would say their hold over peoples mind meant the secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects.
Great Britian has arguably had a huge influence here on the history of christianity here as in all of our colonies the Church of England was pretty much forced upon the natives. This is what helped Christianity become truly global.
Saying Churches only came to power in the 16th century is mistaken as they really came to power as soon as people in a respective country came starte to believe in Jesus, whenever that point may be.
To replace it, I would say something along the lines of " After the dark ages, power systems in Europe had become fully formed, with the secular rulers having power over their subjects bodies and the clergy having control over peoples afterlife. The church also retained power over education as the only free schools were ones which were run by monks. While this was good in obvious ways it did however continue the Christian message" Bertrand Russel has a really good section on this so it's worth a read if you can get a copy. I'm going to submit a more complete section tomorrow, as I've just got up and I have an exam to revise for haha.
Good Luck with the book!
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26-06-2011, 03:05 AM
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
(26-06-2011 01:49 AM)TAJD Wrote:  Just a note saying that churches have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. I would say their hold over peoples mind meant the secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects.
Great Britian has arguably had a huge influence here on the history of christianity here as in all of our colonies the Church of England was pretty much forced upon the natives. This is what helped Christianity become truly global.
Saying Churches only came to power in the 16th century is mistaken as they really came to power as soon as people in a respective country came starte to believe in Jesus, whenever that point may be.
To replace it, I would say something along the lines of " After the dark ages, power systems in Europe had become fully formed, with the secular rulers having power over their subjects bodies and the clergy having control over peoples afterlife. The church also retained power over education as the only free schools were ones which were run by monks. While this was good in obvious ways it did however continue the Christian message" Bertrand Russel has a really good section on this so it's worth a read if you can get a copy. I'm going to submit a more complete section tomorrow, as I've just got up and I have an exam to revise for haha.
Good Luck with the book!

Fabulous! Thankyou! Here is revised version...

"Christian churches have had an integral and profound effect on the history of the world. They have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. Their hold over peoples’ minds often meant secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects. In the sixteenth century, they became proficient at wielding power to influence nations and their people using the Holy Scriptures. Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. In modern times, although the power of churches has been reduced, some churches are still very wealthy, very powerful and have close links with the world’s governments, stock markets and financial institutions. The Vatican, for example, is the wealthiest institution in the world. Every day churchmen give their opinions from the pulpit and through the media, advising people on social, moral and even scientific issues. In America, for example, some churches own television and radio stations. Their activities are often financed by tax-free money. They educate a large proportion of the western world’s children. They are a very diverse bunch, yet there is one thing they all have in common; they claim to derive their authority from the Bible. All discussion about the merit of Christianity ultimately hinges on the legitimacy of the Bible, the very heart of Christianity. It has been and is the most important and influential book in the world. It colours people’s attitudes to non-Christians, war, women, sexuality, law, science and learning. I have spent six years researching the history of the Bible, and I want to share what I have discovered with you. "

Good luck with your exam! Warm regards, Mark
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26-06-2011, 03:19 AM
 
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
(26-06-2011 03:05 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(26-06-2011 01:49 AM)TAJD Wrote:  Just a note saying that churches have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. I would say their hold over peoples mind meant the secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects.
Great Britian has arguably had a huge influence here on the history of christianity here as in all of our colonies the Church of England was pretty much forced upon the natives. This is what helped Christianity become truly global.
Saying Churches only came to power in the 16th century is mistaken as they really came to power as soon as people in a respective country came starte to believe in Jesus, whenever that point may be.
To replace it, I would say something along the lines of " After the dark ages, power systems in Europe had become fully formed, with the secular rulers having power over their subjects bodies and the clergy having control over peoples afterlife. The church also retained power over education as the only free schools were ones which were run by monks. While this was good in obvious ways it did however continue the Christian message" Bertrand Russel has a really good section on this so it's worth a read if you can get a copy. I'm going to submit a more complete section tomorrow, as I've just got up and I have an exam to revise for haha.
Good Luck with the book!

Fabulous! Thankyou! Here is revised version...

"Christian churches have had an integral and profound effect on the history of the world. They have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. Their hold over peoples’ minds often meant secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects. In the sixteenth century, they became proficient at wielding power to influence nations and their people using the Holy Scriptures. Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. In modern times, although the power of churches has been reduced, some churches are still very wealthy, very powerful and have close links with the world’s governments, stock markets and financial institutions. The Vatican, for example, is the wealthiest institution in the world. Every day churchmen give their opinions from the pulpit and through the media, advising people on social, moral and even scientific issues. In America, for example, some churches own television and radio stations. Their activities are often financed by tax-free money. They educate a large proportion of the western world’s children. They are a very diverse bunch, yet there is one thing they all have in common; they claim to derive their authority from the Bible. All discussion about the merit of Christianity ultimately hinges on the legitimacy of the Bible, the very heart of Christianity. It has been and is the most important and influential book in the world. It colours people’s attitudes to non-Christians, war, women, sexuality, law, science and learning. I have spent six years researching the history of the Bible, and I want to share what I have discovered with you. "

Good luck with your exam! Warm regards, Mark

That is very well written Mark. Just one thought.... you have used "integral" in he first 2 sentences, maybe a different word could be used the second time???? maybe - intrinsic, essential or vital.

Keep up the great work. I can't wait until we can read it all.
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26-06-2011, 03:51 AM
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
(26-06-2011 03:19 AM)Sweetpea Wrote:  
(26-06-2011 03:05 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(26-06-2011 01:49 AM)TAJD Wrote:  Just a note saying that churches have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. I would say their hold over peoples mind meant the secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects.
Great Britian has arguably had a huge influence here on the history of christianity here as in all of our colonies the Church of England was pretty much forced upon the natives. This is what helped Christianity become truly global.
Saying Churches only came to power in the 16th century is mistaken as they really came to power as soon as people in a respective country came starte to believe in Jesus, whenever that point may be.
To replace it, I would say something along the lines of " After the dark ages, power systems in Europe had become fully formed, with the secular rulers having power over their subjects bodies and the clergy having control over peoples afterlife. The church also retained power over education as the only free schools were ones which were run by monks. While this was good in obvious ways it did however continue the Christian message" Bertrand Russel has a really good section on this so it's worth a read if you can get a copy. I'm going to submit a more complete section tomorrow, as I've just got up and I have an exam to revise for haha.
Good Luck with the book!

Fabulous! Thankyou! Here is revised version...

"Christian churches have had an integral and profound effect on the history of the world. They have been integral to the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. Their hold over peoples’ minds often meant secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects. In the sixteenth century, they became proficient at wielding power to influence nations and their people using the Holy Scriptures. Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. In modern times, although the power of churches has been reduced, some churches are still very wealthy, very powerful and have close links with the world’s governments, stock markets and financial institutions. The Vatican, for example, is the wealthiest institution in the world. Every day churchmen give their opinions from the pulpit and through the media, advising people on social, moral and even scientific issues. In America, for example, some churches own television and radio stations. Their activities are often financed by tax-free money. They educate a large proportion of the western world’s children. They are a very diverse bunch, yet there is one thing they all have in common; they claim to derive their authority from the Bible. All discussion about the merit of Christianity ultimately hinges on the legitimacy of the Bible, the very heart of Christianity. It has been and is the most important and influential book in the world. It colours people’s attitudes to non-Christians, war, women, sexuality, law, science and learning. I have spent six years researching the history of the Bible, and I want to share what I have discovered with you. "

Good luck with your exam! Warm regards, Mark

That is very well written Mark. Just one thought.... you have used "integral" in he first 2 sentences, maybe a different word could be used the second time???? maybe - intrinsic, essential or vital.

Keep up the great work. I can't wait until we can read it all.
Wink

Hallo "sweetpea", thank you too for your interest! Can't believe I didn't see that myself. I'll replace integral with intrinsic. Thanks!

"Christian churches have had an integral and profound effect on the history of the world. They have been an intrinsic part of the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. Their hold over peoples’ minds often meant secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects. In the sixteenth century, they became proficient at wielding power to influence nations and their people using the Holy Scriptures. Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. In modern times, although the power of churches has been reduced, some churches are still very wealthy, very powerful and have close links with the world’s governments, stock markets and financial institutions. The Vatican, for example, is the wealthiest institution in the world. Every day churchmen give their opinions from the pulpit and through the media, advising people on social, moral and even scientific issues. In America, for example, some churches own television and radio stations. Their activities are often financed by tax-free money. They educate a large proportion of the western world’s children. They are a very diverse bunch, yet there is one thing they all have in common; they claim to derive their authority from the Bible. All discussion about the merit of Christianity ultimately hinges on the legitimacy of the Bible, the very heart of Christianity. It has been and is the most important and influential book in the world. It colours people’s attitudes to non-Christians, war, women, sexuality, law, science and learning. I have spent six years researching the history of the Bible, and I want to share what I have discovered with you. "
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26-06-2011, 04:22 AM
 
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
Quote: Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. "
In the medieval era, which Bertrand Russel defines as AD 400 to about AD 1400, the (Catholic) church had a monopoly over education, as usually part of a church was a free school set up to educate the children of local businessmen as well as the landed gentry. This meant that the Churches maintained its grip over the institutions of the states it was in.

I'll also quote some of what Russel writes as its pretty good:
Quote:The Church is a social institution built upon a creed, partly philosophic, partly concerned with sacred history. It achieved power and wealth by means of its creed. The lay (secular) rulers, who were in frequent conflict with it, were defeated because the great majority of the population, including most of the lay rulers themselves, were profoundly convinced of the truth of the Catholic faith.
- Bertrand Russel, A History of Western Philosophy, introduction to book 2.
I've added anything in brackets.

An important thing is to consider both sides of each point.
Throughout the Medieval era, the church kept literacy alive. After the barbarian invasion, any sort of secular institution was destroyed, the wealthy middle class were reduced to refugees after the fall of the roman empire. It could be argued that the Catholic Church and the respective rulers of the Barbarian Hordes filled the power vacuum left by the collapse of Roman Bureaucracy and the destruction of the Roman Army as a cohesive fighting force. Throughout the turbulent times that followed, the Church kept all forms of learning alive, albeit to glorify the man-god Jesus.

Thanks, I've done shitloads of revision already so it should be ok haha.
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26-06-2011, 05:12 AM (This post was last modified: 26-06-2011 05:21 AM by Mark Fulton.)
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
(26-06-2011 04:22 AM)TAJD Wrote:  
Quote: Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. "
In the medieval era, which Bertrand Russel defines as AD 400 to about AD 1400, the (Catholic) church had a monopoly over education, as usually part of a church was a free school set up to educate the children of local businessmen as well as the landed gentry. This meant that the Churches maintained its grip over the institutions of the states it was in.

I'll also quote some of what Russel writes as its pretty good:
Quote:The Church is a social institution built upon a creed, partly philosophic, partly concerned with sacred history. It achieved power and wealth by means of its creed. The lay (secular) rulers, who were in frequent conflict with it, were defeated because the great majority of the population, including most of the lay rulers themselves, were profoundly convinced of the truth of the Catholic faith.
- Bertrand Russel, A History of Western Philosophy, introduction to book 2.
I've added anything in brackets.

An important thing is to consider both sides of each point.
Throughout the Medieval era, the church kept literacy alive. After the barbarian invasion, any sort of secular institution was destroyed, the wealthy middle class were reduced to refugees after the fall of the roman empire. It could be argued that the Catholic Church and the respective rulers of the Barbarian Hordes filled the power vacuum left by the collapse of Roman Bureaucracy and the destruction of the Roman Army as a cohesive fighting force. Throughout the turbulent times that followed, the Church kept all forms of learning alive, albeit to glorify the man-god Jesus.

Thanks, I've done shitloads of revision already so it should be ok haha.

Hi.....thanks again! You gotta love Bertrand. In a minute I'll work out a way of including what you've said about 400-1400.

Mmmmmmmmm. I am no expert on medieval history...but there are reputable historians out there who claim Christianity actually was responsible for creating the "dark ages". One can't help but suspect that may be true considering the suppression of learning , discussion of history, the burning of libraries and universities undertaken by Christianity. The Greek and Roman empires were magnificent and learning and science flourished by the standards of the time . Then along came Christianity and 1000 years of squalor and filth and suppression of science. Fascinating to ponder over all of this. talk soon, Mark


(26-06-2011 05:12 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(26-06-2011 04:22 AM)TAJD Wrote:  
Quote: Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. "
In the medieval era, which Bertrand Russel defines as AD 400 to about AD 1400, the (Catholic) church had a monopoly over education, as usually part of a church was a free school set up to educate the children of local businessmen as well as the landed gentry. This meant that the Churches maintained its grip over the institutions of the states it was in.

I'll also quote some of what Russel writes as its pretty good:
Quote:The Church is a social institution built upon a creed, partly philosophic, partly concerned with sacred history. It achieved power and wealth by means of its creed. The lay (secular) rulers, who were in frequent conflict with it, were defeated because the great majority of the population, including most of the lay rulers themselves, were profoundly convinced of the truth of the Catholic faith.
- Bertrand Russel, A History of Western Philosophy, introduction to book 2.
I've added anything in brackets.

An important thing is to consider both sides of each point.
Throughout the Medieval era, the church kept literacy alive. After the barbarian invasion, any sort of secular institution was destroyed, the wealthy middle class were reduced to refugees after the fall of the roman empire. It could be argued that the Catholic Church and the respective rulers of the Barbarian Hordes filled the power vacuum left by the collapse of Roman Bureaucracy and the destruction of the Roman Army as a cohesive fighting force. Throughout the turbulent times that followed, the Church kept all forms of learning alive, albeit to glorify the man-god Jesus.

Thanks, I've done shitloads of revision already so it should be ok haha.

Hi.....thanks again! You gotta love Bertrand. In a minute I'll work out a way of including what you've said about 400-1400.

Mmmmmmmmm. I am no expert on medieval history...but there are reputable historians out there who claim Christianity actually was responsible for creating the "dark ages". One can't help but suspect that may be true considering the suppression of learning , discussion of history, the burning of libraries and universities undertaken by Christianity. The Greek and Roman empires were magnificent and learning and science flourished by the standards of the time . Then along came Christianity and 1000 years of squalor and filth and suppression of science. Fascinating to ponder over all of this. talk soon, Mark

Another revision...
"Christian churches have had an integral and profound effect on the history of the world. They have been an intrinsic part of the power structure of many states since the collapse of the Roman Empire. In the medieval era, from roughly 400 CE to about 1400, the Catholic church had a monopoly over education, as usually part of a church was a free school set up to educate the children of local businessmen as well as the landed gentry. Their hold over peoples’ minds often meant secular rulers had to have the clergy on their side in order to have full control of their subjects. In the sixteenth century, they became proficient at wielding power to influence nations and their people using the Holy Scriptures. Churches also retained power over the majority of education, as the only free schools were ones that were run by monks. In modern times, although the power of churches has been reduced, some churches are still very wealthy, very powerful and have close links with the world’s governments, stock markets and financial institutions. The Vatican, for example, is the wealthiest institution in the world. Every day churchmen give their opinions from the pulpit and through the media, advising people on social, moral and even scientific issues. In America, for example, some churches own television and radio stations. Their activities are often financed by tax-free money. They educate a large proportion of the western world’s children. They are a very diverse bunch, yet there is one thing they all have in common; they claim to derive their authority from the Bible. All discussion about the merit of Christianity ultimately hinges on the legitimacy of the Bible, the very heart of Christianity. It has been and is the most important and influential book in the world. It colours people’s attitudes to non-Christians, war, women, sexuality, law, science and learning. I have spent six years researching the history of the Bible, and I want to share what I have discovered with you. "
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26-06-2011, 07:38 AM
 
RE: Anyone Interested In Critiquing My Book?
The burning of libraries is certainly true, and is a point didnt think of. Parallels could perhaps be drawn with some fundamentalist islamists today.
While this is true the barbarians weren't really into reading which was a point I was trying to make.
Pedant point, im not sure if the greeks had an empire, it was really a collection of city states which were united through a shared culture and history, but still fought amongst themselves.
I'm liking what your writing, keep it up!
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