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19-02-2014, 01:18 PM
RE: Anyone else?
OK, I'll start with Genesis (not to be unoriginal, but to start from the beginning):

Starting out in Genesis, why does the Bible immediately contradict itself with two creation stories?
IE: Genesis 1:1-2:3 then Genesis 2:4-25.

Each tells a different story. Which leads me to ask many questions, such as:
  1. When were plants created?
  2. Were humans created before or after the other animals?
  3. Does God work on the Sabbath?
  4. When was Eve created?

Just to name a few. How do you explain this?

Bible references (so you know I'm not making anything up):
  1. Plants were created before humans.
    (Genesis 1:11-13, 27-31)
    Plants were created after humans.
    (Genesis 2:4-9)
  2. After the other animals.
    (Genesis 1:25-27)
    Before the other animals.
    (Genesis 2:18-19)
  3. Yes.
    (John 5:16-17) I know it's not in Genesis, but still counts.
    No.
    (Genesis 2:2-3)
  4. At the same time as Adam.
    (Genesis 1:27)
    After Adam and all the animals were created.
    (Genesis 2:20-22)

I've tried to make this as easy as possible, including the addition of references and the organization of my post. If I have not made myself clear in any way, please let me know you are in need of clarification.

Atir aissom atir imon
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19-02-2014, 01:25 PM
RE: Anyone else?
Drich, another simple question in regard to the book of genesis: who were the authors? Can you take a crazy bunch of stories as true without even knowing 100% who the original writer was?

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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19-02-2014, 01:28 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 01:15 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  And how the fuck can we trust the person writing this book?

This is the most important question. The second most important thing is: even if we thought that the authors were genuine in their beliefs in what they wrote, how can we trust God? He's the least trustworthy entity in the whole book. Even more so than Satan. YHWH gives us rules we need to follow, including not lying, and then he constantly breaks his own rules.

If YHWH has no moral imperative to not kill us, how do we know he's not lying to us?
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19-02-2014, 01:34 PM (This post was last modified: 19-02-2014 01:50 PM by Raptor Jesus.)
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 11:17 AM)Drich Wrote:  
(18-02-2014 10:32 PM)Raptor Jesus Wrote:  I have a question for you; do you think Christianity is any more believable than Pinocchio?

believable how?

Webster’s Dictionary defines “believable” as…

be•liev•able
adjective \-ˈlē-və-bəl\

Definition of BELIEVABLE:
capable of being believed especially as within the range of known possibility or probability
— be•liev•abil•i•ty \-ˌlē-və-ˈbi-lə-tē\ noun
— be•liev•ably \-ˈlē-və-blē\ adverb


Examples of BELIEVABLE

1. <she had a believable excuse for missing the deadline>

First Known Use of BELIEVABLE
14th century

Related to BELIEVABLE

Synonyms
CREDIBLE, CREDITABLE, LIKELY, PLAUSIBLE, PRESUMPTIVE, PROBABLE
Antonyms
FAR-FETCHED, IMPLAUSIBLE, IMPROBABLE, INCREDIBLE, UNBELIEVABLE, UNLIKELY, UNPLAUSIBLE
Related Words
COGENT, COMPELLING, CONCLUSIVE, CONVINCING, DECISIVE, EFFECTIVE, FORCEFUL, PERSUASIVE, SATISFYING, STRONG, TELLING; ACCEPTABLE, COGITABLE, CONCEIVABLE, IMAGINABLE, POSSIBLE, PRACTICAL, REASONABLE; DEPENDABLE, RELIABLE, TRUSTWORTHY; SOPHISTIC (or SOPHISTICAL), SPECIOUS
Near Antonyms
ABSURD, DOUBTFUL, DUBIOUS, FANTASTIC (also FANTASTICAL), FLIMSY, OUTLANDISH, PREPOSTEROUS, QUESTIONABLE, RIDICULOUS; IMPOSSIBLE, INCONCEIVABLE, UNIMAGINABLE, UNTHINKABLE; SKEPTICAL, SUSPECT, SUSPICIOUS, UNCERTAIN, UNSURE; HOPELESS, UNWORKABLE, USELESS
Rhymes with BELIEVABLE
ACHIEVABLE, CONCEIVABLE, DECEIVABLE, PERCEIVABLE, RECEIVABLE, RELIEVABLE, RETRIEVABLE



Hopefully that clears that up. Now, with all due respect, please answer the fucking question.

...
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19-02-2014, 03:33 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 11:54 AM)Youkay Wrote:  
(19-02-2014 11:17 AM)Drich Wrote:  believable how?

How can you ask such an irrelevant, insignificant and unproductive question?! It demonstrates that you are either a dim-wit or a nitpick.

In case you don't know English, here is the definition of "believe":

believe: accept that (something) is true


This is why people think you are either intellectually incapacitated or dishonest.
I simply want to know in what way is he determining what is believable and what is not. there are aspects of pinoco, that are very believable and others are not. I was looking to gage the OP's measure of believeablity. Is he one who see one tiny flaw and at that point wanting to throw the whole story out or is he willing to accept what is acceptiable and question the rest.

Just because you have closed your mind to thinking beyond your current processes, does not make me dishonest because my thought processes differ from your own.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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19-02-2014, 04:00 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(18-02-2014 11:35 PM)Youkay Wrote:  Drich, I am sorry to say this, but I had to let go of a lot of things, so that the conversation doesn't dissolve in replies that span multiple pages. And I only warned you when I thought that it was getting out of hand. Maybe you should try to be more self-critical?
The reason I allowed the conversation to exceed your comfort level with the rules is i did not want the 'rules' to compromise what I had to say. Otherwise I had no issue staying in your comfort zone.

Quote:People on this forum think you have no humility, because you seem to be very convinced of yourself
If you spoke God's truth would you take that light and hold it up for the world to see, or hide it under a bush? what did Christ do? what did the Apstoles do? What was the general impression of thier work and words? They were all martyred because they would not back off their unpopular speech. I have an obligation to speak the truth without shame fear or compromise. If you see pride in this, then so be it. The name Daniel means God is my Judge. I am aptly named.

Quote:even though the general impression is that you do a lot of mistakes.
If that were the case then why weren't you able to point them out in our discussion? It wasn't for the lack of trying on your part.
Understand not a criticism or me pounding my chest here. I am honestly asking this. If my theology was a miss then why hasn't anyone to this point be able to call me on anything yet? Why does every conversation end with a personal attack rather than a call to scriptural integrity?

I completely understand why the general impression is that I make mistakes. It because what I say is off from what most understand Christianity to be. So allow me an obvious question. Who is far more likly to be wrong about a given religion, One who has devoted his life (4 to 8 hours aday to reading/researching the bible in order to answer your questions) or the one who does not even believe in God? Who's total exposure is at best 20 years of luke warm devotion 2 to 3 hours a week one day a week?

It takes a proud man to assume that in his disbelief he has a better understanding of a religion than one who has devoted all of himself to God. Yet when the members of this forum say I am in error simply because what they remember from sunday school tells them differently, or something some website says that they happen to agree with.. This is exactly what is going on. Because I have met with very little more than a ya-huh when I challenge one of your sunday school doctrines.. Or I get accused of Apologist acrobatics when I refute one of your website paradoxes. So tell me again who is speaking from a position of pride? One who has humbled himself and done the research for the last 17 or 18 years or the one who think he has a complete understanding of God, Christianity and 'reality' simply because some website you like favors your POV?

Quote:I am sorry to say this, but this is honest feed-back. Do with it as you like.
Thank you. Would you like some honest feed back yourself?

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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19-02-2014, 04:01 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 12:53 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(18-02-2014 05:05 PM)Drich Wrote:  I didn't have anything in mind. I'm up for anything. Maybe for this first one we keep it light. Slavery, homosexuality, or we can go back and finish what UK started. It really does not matter so long as it conforms to the rules.

I didn't read your YouKay debate.

How about "teaching about creation in schools"?
That will be fine, but it will probably be a short debate.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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19-02-2014, 04:10 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 07:30 AM)Youkay Wrote:  
(18-02-2014 01:18 PM)Drich Wrote:  I've already got 7 pages of dialog that says otherwise. Uk was a stickler about the rules, and called me on them when he thought I wandered too far out of bounds.

Besides what a oppertunity for an intelect such as yours to make a fool of someone like me. Especially, if you can get me to break my own rules in the process. Wink

Drich, to be honest, I was not at all a stickler. Everyone can go over there and have a look at our conversation. You can't imagine how many PM's I received, complementing me on my patience with you. You have violated the rules over and over again, but I didn't call you out on that in order to let the conversation flow. Only in instances where I could not tolerate it any longer, I called you out.

You should learn to become more self-critical. You parade a badge of "humility" while being arrogant and intellectually dishonest. Do you ever question yourself as a person?

It appears the whole forum thinks you are overly confident with yourself, even though you make a lot of trivial mistakes while communicating and debating with others. Your arguments, logic and deduction are all average. And still you are convinced that you are intellectually strong.

Of course, I know that you will pretend that the whole forum has a wrong impression of you. But take this as a genuine feed-back. Start to be more self-critical.
Laugh out load so what you could not do with logic and reason you look to do with attacks on my pride.

If I was the proud man you have made me out to be I would be obligated to respond..

Here about all the response you will get:

Meh..
I know that I am below average in my ablity to communicate, my logic and resoning is also in or near minimal levels.. So what.:dontcare: Because bottom line even in my weakness the message I gave you was strong enough that you best efforts could not break it.

To me that says one of two things. Your not as smart as you think You are (meaning you have to be below me) Which I know that to not be true, Or I speak in God's Absolute truth. Which if done correctly a monkey could do and not mess up. Which is why despite all my failings you still quit the conversation.

Ooo Ooo ah ah.. (monkey sounds)Big Grin

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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19-02-2014, 04:12 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 04:01 PM)Drich Wrote:  
(19-02-2014 12:53 AM)DLJ Wrote:  I didn't read your YouKay debate.

How about "teaching about creation in schools"?
That will be fine, but it will probably be a short debate.

Because you already have your mind made up.... and thats, that.

Get out in the real world much? FFS, why do I even bother? Drinking Beverage

If bullshit were music some people would be a brass band.
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19-02-2014, 04:14 PM
RE: Anyone else?
(19-02-2014 11:33 AM)Timber1025 Wrote:  "So I say to you: Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. 10 For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened."

So if you based so much of your faith on this passage in the book of Luke, what do have to say about the line right after the ask, seek, knock crap you keep shoveling? I, and many others have asked (and did not recieve), and seeked (but did not find). I mean it damn well says that everyone who asks will recieve (I assume this refers to the holy spirit). I am sure you will rationalize and make up an answer that supports your claims, but to me this passage is a flat out lie. Again if want to keep pushing the first satement as the only correct way to truth, you will need to accept the next sentence as truth - "everyone who asks recieves". FALSE.
How to proceed? One few if anyone outside of a charasmatic Chruch asks for the Holy Spirit.
Or Two In your paragraph you spoke to those who asked and sought...

Consider hmmm I guess we will go with 2

The passage in Luke 11 does not say ask and seek.

It says Ask Seek and Knock. If your not currently knocking then you did not follow the instructions found in Luke 11.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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