Poll: Should children always obey you, no matter what you tell them?
Yes, "Because I said so" is all that's necessary
No, I want my children to grow up to be hippies
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Are Children Slaves?
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10-12-2011, 06:23 PM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
(09-12-2011 09:19 PM)Clint Barnett Wrote:  I was a paratrooper, I definitely don't train them to jump. Reading your comment directed at me I can only assume you are assuming I'm a hard ass. You couldn't be further from the truth. If this is what you are assuming. I'm probably more laid back than most parents. I just won't let dumb shit slide.

Fair enough. It was that whole dictator thing that threw me off. Wink

(09-12-2011 09:19 PM)Clint Barnett Wrote:  If you say that anything you learned in the Navy didn't influence you in any way then I'd have to say you weren't being fully truthful. .... I'm guessing(probably wrong) you took your naval experience as a negative one.

Yes, you are wrong. Quite the contrary in fact. I was in their nuclear power program. I credit them with teaching me the proper way to study. They turned a D high school student into a magna cum laude college graduate. The Navy was the best thing that ever happened to me. Big Grin

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13-12-2011, 02:15 AM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
I'm not sure this makes sense but I would say no if looking at it in a simple form of who has control of the ownership.

An owner can let his slave free if he is satisfied or feels paid back for whatever reason.. a Parent can't let his child go free without the government punishing them for that action.

I don't see the child as a slave to the parent in terms of ownership... Maybe the government owns the child more than the parent, or maybe the government owns us all, I gotta make a call to the atheist experience about the Illuminati now! Tongue
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13-12-2011, 12:01 PM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
Not accusing anybody or anything, obviously, but I'd like to point out that the attitude of "my kids are my property", demands of absolute compliance regardless of the child's needs and preferences, and dictatorial control are all symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder in a parent. The child is seen not as a separate human being deserving of respect and dignity, but as an extension of themselves, a "blank slate" on which the parent has the right to write itself. Food for thought.

English is not my first language. If you think I am being mean, ask me. It could be just a wording problem.
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13-12-2011, 02:43 PM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
(13-12-2011 12:01 PM)sy2502 Wrote:  Not accusing anybody or anything, obviously, but I'd like to point out that the attitude of "my kids are my property", demands of absolute compliance regardless of the child's needs and preferences, and dictatorial control are all symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder in a parent. The child is seen not as a separate human being deserving of respect and dignity, but as an extension of themselves, a "blank slate" on which the parent has the right to write itself. Food for thought.

I wouldn't go so far as to call it a disorder, especially since this appears to be how the average American (maybe average human?) treats parenting. You can learn from modeling the behavior of others, especially when you're praised for it. And there does seem to be a lot of praise for parents that "rule with an iron fist", as opposed to parents who "don't have control" of their children.

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13-12-2011, 03:03 PM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
(13-12-2011 02:43 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  
(13-12-2011 12:01 PM)sy2502 Wrote:  Not accusing anybody or anything, obviously, but I'd like to point out that the attitude of "my kids are my property", demands of absolute compliance regardless of the child's needs and preferences, and dictatorial control are all symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder in a parent. The child is seen not as a separate human being deserving of respect and dignity, but as an extension of themselves, a "blank slate" on which the parent has the right to write itself. Food for thought.

I wouldn't go so far as to call it a disorder, especially since this appears to be how the average American (maybe average human?) treats parenting. You can learn from modeling the behavior of others, especially when you're praised for it. And there does seem to be a lot of praise for parents that "rule with an iron fist", as opposed to parents who "don't have control" of their children.

Exactly what I was thinking when I read it. I'd go as far as maybe calling it a condition brought on by a society disorder as a whole. I think that is what you were saying anyway.

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06-01-2012, 01:14 PM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
Interesting poll. False choice fallacy!?
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07-01-2012, 12:01 AM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
(13-12-2011 12:01 PM)sy2502 Wrote:  Not accusing anybody or anything...

The agnostic shotgun. Big Grin

Lemme give you some lizard brain perspective. If you give me shit, I kill you. If your child gives me shit, first I gotta hunt you down, then kill you both. Therefore, child is identity - despite the biological classification, human is unnaturally invested with identity.

Ya know what sure is ironic? Atheists turn into a mob, try to call atheism a religion; but that shit ain't "living human worthy of respect," that's shit's evolved top predator. People start investing these words with emotional context and call it tolerance... I'm just gonna be intolerant., Wink

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08-01-2012, 09:38 AM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
I did not vote on the poll because there is no middle ground.

If my child was my slave it would be something I own. But I do not feel I own my child (I don't have one yet but this is what I think about it in general). I brought it to live, that was my desicion, now it is my duty to raise it properly.
Raising my child means making a lot of decisions for it. Once it is old enough it can voice it's opinion, we can talk about things.
But just like in the example on page 2. If my child runs to the open street, which I hope will never happen, it has to stop now when I yell "stop". And that may be something my child learns fast. I am sure that there will be situations when I simply overrule my childs opinion.
It will not decide wether it wants to do homework, it will do it period.
It will not decide that it doesn't want to school today, it will go.
It will not decide wether it wants to see the doctor when it's ill, it will see the doc.
But as you see, these are the important things. And I will be able to tell my kid why I decide and why my decision is better than there opinion.
There are things where I will let it decide.

About punishment:
As for the spanking. In my opinion it is mostly not nessesary. I haven't been spanked at all and I came out pretty ok. I got other punishments that worked just great. No TV, being grounded, more housework, and all the psychological stuff my mom did. Of course looking back I think that sometimes she could have spared me the speech and just spank me and it would have done the same.
Many parents won't find a limit once they start spanking. It won't be the flat hand on the butt anymore after a few times. It will be the belt on the back, the wooden spoon on the head... no sorry not cool. No matter what, that's not cool.
A spank is the very last resort.
Something that comes supersurprising for my kid because it did not expect it will do wonders but if I do it everytime it is disrespectful or does something bad it is not special anymore and loses a lot of the effect. My father beat up my brothers like hell, they didn't care at all. They let him do it, the'd cry cause it hurts and than they'd go outside and do the same shit all over.
I'd be sent on a guilt trip and not do it ever again.

But back to the topic:
I will not enslave my kids. And enslaving means making them work all the time, never giving them rest, no love, no pay, nothing. You live here so you work for me. I am your parent so I own you. No sir. It will do it's part for the household and it will do homework and maybe additional tasks but all to a normal degree. It will still have time for friends and fun, it will be welcome to express it's opinion and I will be open for everything if it feels the need to talk about something.

k, that's my little novel

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09-01-2012, 05:31 AM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
The poll options are a bit..silly.
What does obedience of someone's child has to do with the child becoming a hippie?
More on-topic though,i definitely want them to question everything they wish and form their own opinions.
And i am definitely not planning on using physical force against them in any way either.

The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.
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09-01-2012, 11:45 AM
RE: Are Children Slaves?
(07-01-2012 12:01 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(13-12-2011 12:01 PM)sy2502 Wrote:  Not accusing anybody or anything...

The agnostic shotgun. Big Grin

Lemme give you some lizard brain perspective. If you give me shit, I kill you. If your child gives me shit, first I gotta hunt you down, then kill you both. Therefore, child is identity - despite the biological classification, human is unnaturally invested with identity.

Ya know what sure is ironic? Atheists turn into a mob, try to call atheism a religion; but that shit ain't "living human worthy of respect," that's shit's evolved top predator. People start investing these words with emotional context and call it tolerance... I'm just gonna be intolerant., Wink

I have no idea what this post means.

English is not my first language. If you think I am being mean, ask me. It could be just a wording problem.
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