Poll: Should wearing seatbelts be a law?
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Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
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05-04-2013, 01:42 PM
Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
I feel partial to this. Are seatbelt/helmet laws invading our freedom of choice? Laws are set out to protect others, but what about yourself? Some people feel they should have the choice to wear seatbelts/helmets, while others feel it should be a law to potect them. But isn't that breaking American freedom rules?Blink

“You just go where your high-top sneakers sneak, and don't forget to use your head.”
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05-04-2013, 01:45 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
(05-04-2013 01:42 PM)CaffinatedPuppy Wrote:  I feel partial to this. Are seatbelt/helmet laws invading our freedom of choice? Laws are set out to protect others, but what about yourself? Some people feel they should have the choice to wear seatbelts/helmets, while others feel it should be a law to potect them. But isn't that breaking American freedom rules?Blink

Atwater v. Lago Vista, 532 U.S. 318 (2001), was a United States Supreme Court decision which held that a person's Fourth Amendment rights are not violated when the subject is arrested for driving without a seatbelt. The court ruled that such an arrest for a misdemeanor that is punishable only by a fine does not constitute an unreasonable seizure under the Fourth Amendment.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense

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05-04-2013, 01:49 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
Some people would say paying a fine for your freedom of choice is unconstitutional. Is taking away money for a person's choice unconstitutional? Wouldn't that be stealing?

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05-04-2013, 01:57 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
(05-04-2013 01:49 PM)CaffinatedPuppy Wrote:  Some people would say paying a fine for your freedom of choice is unconstitutional. Is taking away money for a person's choice unconstitutional? Wouldn't that be stealing?

By your logic almost any law would be unconstitutional. But for the record the supreme court has the ultimate power of determining constitutionality and since they said yes it is constitutional.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense

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05-04-2013, 01:57 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
Sure it would be an invasion of choice, but if people that are dumb enough to not wear them they should have the right to have their body thrown around like a ragged doll in the interior of their car, most likely leaving them outside the car.

It's called 'natural selection' and it strengthens the species by ridding the 'gene pool' of those too stupid to survive

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses." - Abraham Lincoln
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05-04-2013, 02:18 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
So are smart people protecting stupid people?

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05-04-2013, 02:26 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
Perhaps you could make the argument that it is their choice to wear it and be injured if they then make a mistake and have an accident, but what of the reverse? What if they choose not to wear their seat belt, and are impacted by another distracted driver? Let's say the other driver is unequivocally at fault, but his error was minor in that he did not look to his left before pulling out, and was side-swiped by the victim. Let's say the road has a fairly low speed limit (30 mph). While not at high speeds, and not a particularly egregious error, this could prove to be a fatal car crash. If the person not a fault dies in such an incident, should it be manslaughter? If preventable via a seat belt, should it still be manslaughter?

The protection is not just physical in nature and I don't think it is about "smart" people trying to protect "dumb" people but instead it is trying to protect innocent people.

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05-04-2013, 02:57 PM (This post was last modified: 05-04-2013 03:11 PM by Heathen.)
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
(05-04-2013 01:57 PM)Misenhelter Wrote:  It's called 'natural selection' and it strengthens the species by ridding the 'gene pool' of those too stupid to survive

I agree with this. ^

Unconstitutional? As I understand it, yes, probably.
And I also believe that insurance companies should be able to refuse to pay for people's stupidity if they wish by putting it into the contract. Or not. Their choice.

Publicly funded health care as we have in Canada and other countries, MediCare/Medicaid in the US, is a bit more complicated.

"Which is more likely: that the whole natural order is suspended, or that a jewish minx should tell a lie?"- David Hume
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05-04-2013, 04:34 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
Due to Canadian health care... People better buckle up in a car, and wear a helmet on a bike, cause I don't want my tax dollars paying for others stupidity.

Also, in some cases, a person can become a projectile if not strapped in, endangering others.
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05-04-2013, 04:53 PM
RE: Are seatbelt laws unconstitutional?
Seatbelt and helmet laws are not unconstitutional. They are however, dumb as fuck. One could argue though, even as a Libertarian, that seatbelt laws are not in the interest of self preservation but in the interest of public safety. Any precaution that potentially prevents a body from flying out of a vehicle and into traffic could be considered a public safety issue. Of course that doesn't apply to helmets and one could still argue that there is nothing stopping a motorcyclist from flying into traffic.

So in conclusion, those laws are fuking stupid.

“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

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