Are we living in a comuter simulation?
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08-02-2011, 03:34 AM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
I am starting to think that watching movies like The Matrix and Tron may have noticeable side effects. Tongue

When I find myself in times of trouble, Richard Dawkins comes to me, speaking words of reason, now I see, now I see.
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08-02-2011, 12:28 PM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
Quote:No. Either it's real or it isn't. Object A is object A; it cannot be object A and have properties which are the opposite of A.

I'm still concerned over this . Consider this example :

You and I are looking at a wooden table in sunshine. We are at a different position obviously. The table reflects light coming from the Sun. Since we have a different point of view, the reflected beams will create different patterns on our retina, making us observe the surface of the table differently. Let's say I am observing pattern A and you are observing pattern B on the table. That is plausible since the table is not perfectly smooth, and reflects light in different angles. For me A is undoubtably real and for you B is also undoubtably real, and they cannot be real at the same time for either of us. Futhermore for another observer pattern C is real and neither A or B is.
The point I am trying to make is that reality migth be different for different observers depending on the observations they make.
In other words object A is object A but object B from a different point of view.

..."we can be truly free - not because we can rebel against the the tyranny of the selfish replicators but because we know that there is no one to rebel."
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08-02-2011, 12:34 PM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
(08-02-2011 12:28 PM)TheSelfishGene Wrote:  
Unbeliever Wrote:No. Either it's real or it isn't. Object A is object A; it cannot be object A and have properties which are the opposite of A.

I'm still concerned over this . Consider this example :

You and I are looking at a wooden table in sunshine. We are at a different position obviously. The table reflects light coming from the Sun. Since we have a different point of view, the reflected beams will create different patterns on our retina, making us observe the surface of the table differently. Let's say I am observing pattern A and you are observing pattern B on the table. That is plausible since the table is not perfectly smooth, and reflects light in different angles. For me A is undoubtably real and for you B is also undoubtably real, and they cannot be real at the same time for either of us.

Actually, they're both real at both times. "Light" is not a monolithic entity. It's a collection of photons. It's just that only one of us is in a position to perceive certain streams of them.

They're both undoubtedly real.

Quote:The point I am trying to make is that reality migth be different for different observers depending on the observations they make.

No. The perception of reality might be different for different observers, but reality itself is the same.

Quote:In other words object A is object A but object B from a different point of view.

It's still object A. Just object A perceived in a different way.

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
- Terry Pratchett
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09-02-2011, 11:58 AM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
Okay, that is reasonable.
Still:

Can we know (and if yes how) if we are in a copmuter simulation, but we percieve it as if it were a real universe? I'm sorry If you have mentioned it before.

..."we can be truly free - not because we can rebel against the the tyranny of the selfish replicators but because we know that there is no one to rebel."
Susan Blackmore : The Meme Machine
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09-02-2011, 02:03 PM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
(09-02-2011 11:58 AM)TheSelfishGene Wrote:  Can we know (and if yes how) if we are in a copmuter simulation, but we percieve it as if it were a real universe?

In theory, the answer is yes. There's nothing keeping us from finding out. Even if we are computer simulations, we behave in all ways exactly as though we are conscious, thinking, learning beings capable of understanding the universe. So, given infinite time and ability to search, we should be able to find some point at which the simulation breaks down.

In practice, the answer is probably not. We don't have infinite time in which to conduct our search. We may never find the point at which the simulation breaks down, assuming that there is one. But unless we do, there is absolutely no reason to think that we are living in a simulation.

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
- Terry Pratchett
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10-02-2011, 12:18 AM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
Thanks Unbeliever. You just helped me isolate the point where the computer simulation that we live in breaks down. The god plug-in has totally fried. Tongue

When I find myself in times of trouble, Richard Dawkins comes to me, speaking words of reason, now I see, now I see.
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10-02-2011, 10:20 AM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
Okay, thanks i think I get it now Smile

It's just suck that we are exactly where we started: We don't know and will probably never know.

..."we can be truly free - not because we can rebel against the the tyranny of the selfish replicators but because we know that there is no one to rebel."
Susan Blackmore : The Meme Machine
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10-02-2011, 11:13 AM
RE: Are we living in a comuter simulation?
(10-02-2011 10:20 AM)TheSelfishGene Wrote:  It's just suck that we are exactly where we started: We don't know and will probably never know.

Yep. But until we find otherwise, there's no reason to believe it, so we can safely operate under the assumption that the universe is real.

"Sometimes it is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness."
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