Argument from personal revelation
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
31-08-2017, 10:53 AM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 10:49 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 10:47 AM)WhiskeyDebates Wrote:  Evidence, what Impulse was asking for, is by it's fucking definition something that can be shown. You have none, which is why you can't produce it.

Lol you don't even know what "evidence" is. That's sad. You really are hopelessly brainwashed/programmed.

Wrong. Now fuck off.

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes WhiskeyDebates's post
31-08-2017, 11:34 AM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 10:17 AM)Impulse Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 07:38 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  I guaran-fucking-tee that the only opinions you'll agree with, are mainstream ones with dubious credentials (meaning they could've fabricated the "proof/evidence" out of thin air), and you'd still probably believe it, right? Because it's trendy?

What evidence are you even talking about? You have been refusing to provide any...

Claims like this are made vague for a reason. Once you state something specific that statement can be examined. Trolls don't like that sort of thing.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like RobbyPants's post
31-08-2017, 12:02 PM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 10:08 AM)Impulse Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 02:11 AM)nosferatu323 Wrote:  The way I understand it, you reached a point where you were quite absorbed to your notion of God, after studying religion more, you figured out that they are nonsensical. My question is, why didn't you trust your personal notion of God which was working for you and ignore those religious sources? I mean maybe those religious sources were wrong, but your personal experience was true. What prevented you to believe this?

I'd appreciate your answer.
The short answer is the only "personal experience" I had was the belief. When so many facts and ideas opposed that belief, the belief simply vanished. I had no choice about it.

For the longer answer, I could literally write a book so I'll just give a few examples:

1. The whole idea that Adam and Eve could sin and then it damned all of humanity, not just those two, is ridiculous and unjust.
a. Related to that, the idea that God could leave them in a situation where they didn't yet know right from wrong, but then chastise them for doing "wrong". And what was that wrong? Disobeying God by eating an apple. And for that all humans got disease, natural disasters, birth defects, disabilities, etc. And all this from a perfect, all-loving God. Uh-huh... Drinking Beverage That same God set them up right next to the Tree of Knowledge with a very tempting talking (*ahem*) snake who most certainly was going to talk them into their "disobedience". So this all-knowing God knew exactly what they would do, set them up anyway, and then blamed them for it.

2. The whole idea that Joe can do evil, but Bob can die and somehow make up for Joe's evil. What I really mean by that, but wanted to make it obvious first, is the idea that Jesus dying somehow saves us from original sin when Jesus had nothing to do with committing the original sin and Adam and Eve had nothing to do with making up for their own "sin". How does this dying change anything such that it re-opens the gates to heaven? (rhetorical)

3. The excuse of free will. When asked why God allows evil to exist, many believers reflexively reply "free will" as though that's a good thing. Yet, free will with evil isn't actually better than free will to choose only among non-evil things. Plus, I assume people still have free will in heaven so what's to stop evil from happening there? Logically nothing. So either God will remove free will or something is wrong with the idea that there is no evil in heaven. And if there is really some mechanism - the most common one I've heard is people won't want to choose to do evil - the same could be applied right here on Earth, but it isn't.

4. In college, I made several friends who happened to be gay. They are some of the best and most moral people I have ever met. The whole idea that God would condemn them just for being gay - or even would simply call homosexuality a sin - is ridiculous. God supposedly creates everything. Homosexuality is biological at least much if not all of the time. God created homosexuality then, but called it a sin. That makes no sense.

Those types of things, brought in the doubts which allowed me to examine my beliefs more open-mindedly and more honestly. Then I was able to see other things - like the lack of evidence that any god exists (and by "lack" I mean "zero"), the evidence against the authenticity of the Bible, the atrocities and contradictions in the Bible, the strong evidence suggesting that Jesus might not even have existed as a person let alone a god, and the evil that exists in the whole idea of an egocentric god who wants so much sacrifice and pain, who supposedly allows the devil to influence people into going to hell, and who created and sends people to an eternity of fiery torture.

Thanks for the explanation. While I understand that you started to question your beliefs, I assume the thing that was attracting you was beyond those beliefs, right? If you would have rejected all these ideas and beliefs, dismissing Christianity and Bible altogether, yet something would have remained I guess. The being that you were communicating with was not really dependent on these beliefs I assume.

If my assumption is correct, wasn't it possible for you to keep God while rejecting Christianity?
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
31-08-2017, 12:07 PM (This post was last modified: 31-08-2017 12:50 PM by ResidentEvilFan.)
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 10:23 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  You don't have proof/evidence that a dog loves you, or that you love the dog. Do you really need proof/evidence for that sort of thing?

Sure I do; I can interact with the dog. She's happy when I come home, happy when I play with her, and sad when I leave. Also....she's real.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 7 users Like ResidentEvilFan's post
31-08-2017, 01:54 PM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 12:02 PM)nosferatu323 Wrote:  Thanks for the explanation. While I understand that you started to question your beliefs, I assume the thing that was attracting you was beyond those beliefs, right? If you would have rejected all these ideas and beliefs, dismissing Christianity and Bible altogether, yet something would have remained I guess. The being that you were communicating with was not really dependent on these beliefs I assume.

If my assumption is correct, wasn't it possible for you to keep God while rejecting Christianity?

When I lost my Christian faith, yes something did remain. I still felt "spiritual" for a while and I diverted into new age woo for a short time. But eventually the masks came off of all the religions and woo. Once you're open-minded about one, the others get the same objective scrutiny. So yes, it was possible to keep God while rejecting Christianity, but it didn't happen because all religions and woo suffer similar issues - the biggest being zero evidence that they have any basis in reality.

@DonaldTrump, Patriotism is not honoring your flag no matter what your country/leader does. It's doing whatever it takes to make your country the best it can be as long as its not violent.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like Impulse's post
31-08-2017, 02:01 PM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
Hello! Big Grin

Sorry I'm late to this but I can't resist.

(31-08-2017 10:32 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  A dog is just a belief. Everything is just a belief. Beliefs create reality.








Big Grin
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Peebothuhul's post
01-09-2017, 06:47 AM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 03:30 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 03:26 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  [Image: 445376.jpg]

I know you have an evidence fetish, but you're not getting your fix here.

Here or anywhere. It doesn't exist.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
01-09-2017, 06:49 AM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 08:02 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 07:46 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  Are you aware of how scientific theory works? Like how it becomes "popular/mainstream" ?

Ok, generally, a person(s) will have a hypothesis on how something may/may not work. They will conduct tests that rule out as much interference/outside influences as possible to confirm/deny the original hypothesis. This can can years to do correctly, to make sure all data is correct and that things can be controlled/recreated/proven in a scientific environment. Once this is done, the findings are published to the scientific community, who are free to criticize/run their own tests to also confirm this information. At that point when it is proven, via the majority, to be accurate it becomes a theory:



As such, Atheists and anybody with a rational mind, subscribes to the same method. At this point I would like to mention this is why we don't condone this sort of garbage, but you have NOTHING to say other than "GOD DID IT LOLOLOLOLOL" and when we ask for the evidence, the thing that will prove it to us all, and the only thing we require to actually become believers in this "god" you follow, all you can say is "LOL evidence? who needs that LOLOLOL" and it's just backwards bullshit.

Once you understand how these things work, with you supposedly being "intelligent", then come back with what we're asking for, and if you're correct you'll a have A) converted teh forum and B) [should you evidence be correct and factual] possible converted the entire world in the process.

Go ahead and prove me wrong. That's all Atheists are asking.

It's all just theory. Nothing solid. Nothing solid at all. Stop treating theories and hypotheses as if they are indisputable fact, I can't even tell you how stupid that is. Humans are so ridiculously primitive, they really will believe anything.

So, you DON'T know how science works. Kewl.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
01-09-2017, 06:50 AM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 08:08 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 08:06 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  More equivocations. You know nothing about science, Angry Man.

Don't make me laugh. I know more about (real) science than you'll ever know.

Oh, you mean REAL science.

You're funny. Hobo
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes kemo boy's post
01-09-2017, 07:19 AM
RE: Argument from personal revelation
(31-08-2017 10:23 AM)Angra Mainyu Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 10:17 AM)Impulse Wrote:  What evidence are you even talking about? You have been refusing to provide any...

So I'm going to have to guess that you mean the evidence against gods existing? No one has proof that no god exists anywhere... that is impossible. But there is plenty of evidence that earthly religions are fabricated lies and a statement like yours tells me you are completely unaware of that evidence... yet, you'll speak strongly against it. And that tells me about your intellectual dishonesty. Dodgy

You don't have proof/evidence that a dog loves you, or that you love the dog. Do you really need proof/evidence for that sort of thing?

What!? I have plenty of evidence my animals love me and I love them.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply
Forum Jump: