Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
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23-08-2012, 10:43 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 10:36 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(23-08-2012 10:22 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  What do you think about the idea that with a strict Calvinist view, any kind of Bible is unnecessary? If there is no free will, no choice whether to believe or not believe, then why bother with communicating anything at all? Election really has no bearing on anything but your afterlife, so why create an ambiguous and confusing grouping of texts that really have nothing to do with the majority of people who will ever live? When you die you'll go to heaven. When I die I'll be tortured in hell for eternity. Neither one of us can do anything about it anyway, so why bother with mythology?

I've actually asked myself this question before.

Why do we need the Bible?

Why did God choose this ambiguous, difficult to read, ancient book with multiple authors as His way to communicate with His elect? It surely doesn't seem like a "perfect" way... but again... I'm not infinite, so I don't know.

God chose the Bible as a way to reveal Himself to us so that we can learn, understand, and try to grasp the wholeness of His plan (which we never will).

And, you're right. Damnation and salvation can't be controlled, but I think the Bible is important to help the elect understand and accept this decision that God made.

It's not the elect who need to understand and accept, then, is it?

And you're not elect, so get over yourself.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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23-08-2012, 10:45 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(22-08-2012 08:39 PM)Red Tornado Wrote:  If there is "proof" (like there is "proof" for the Christian God) for other religions, personal experiences to 'validate' the other religions (like Islam, and others) how confident can you say they are not true? And yours is?

Personal experiences are merely complimentary evidence. If personal experience was the sole piece of evidence I gave for Christianity, I would be presenting a very weak. We can ask what if they had just as much historical proof as Christianity, but that would be just a waste of time as that is simply not the case. If we need to start a new thread going into these evidences more in depth, we can, but this thread is meant to give just the short answer to these questions.
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23-08-2012, 10:53 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 10:45 AM)TrueReason Wrote:  
(22-08-2012 08:39 PM)Red Tornado Wrote:  If there is "proof" (like there is "proof" for the Christian God) for other religions, personal experiences to 'validate' the other religions (like Islam, and others) how confident can you say they are not true? And yours is?

Personal experiences are merely complimentary complementary evidence. If personal experience was the sole piece of evidence I gave for Christianity, I would be presenting a very weak. We can ask what if they had just as much historical proof as Christianity, but that would be just a waste of time as that is simply not the case. If we need to start a new thread going into these evidences more in depth, we can, but this thread is meant to give just the short answer to these questions.

Islam arguably has as much or more historical evidence, and Mormonism definitely has more. They are no more believable thereby.

The historicity of the Bible has been shown to be wrong in most of its stories.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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23-08-2012, 10:54 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 10:45 AM)TrueReason Wrote:  We can ask what if they had just as much historical proof as Christianity, but that would be just a waste of time as that is simply not the case.

S'funny that.

I hear that one all the time from my Muslim friends.

Consider

Ah! I see what you are saying. There is not "just as much" proof... there is more proof for Islam.

Allah be praised.

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23-08-2012, 10:55 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(22-08-2012 08:26 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(22-08-2012 07:35 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Yes they do. It's call Biblical Studies. However if you have ever been there, (which I highly doubt), you can talk to them about allowing you into more than one program/department at once, especially if they like you and you grandfather was a major donor. When I ran away from Choate, (high school), and went home, as I missed my horse, my brothers, and my grandmum, my parents told me if I could get into college when I was 16, (which I did), they would not insist I return.

Dude, now you're just starting to sound an elitist rubbing it in. ... Should've just left it alone, I ain't interested in hearing about your privileged history.

I know, huh? Who has a horse? And a Bucky chair at Harvard? Tongue

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23-08-2012, 11:00 AM
Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 10:55 AM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(22-08-2012 08:26 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Dude, now you're just starting to sound an elitist rubbing it in. ... Should've just left it alone, I ain't interested in hearing about your privileged history.

I know, huh? Who has a horse? And a Bucky chair at Harvard? Tongue

Do you really expect anything else from an insufferable know it all with good looks and a surfboard?

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23-08-2012, 11:02 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 10:43 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(23-08-2012 10:36 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  I've actually asked myself this question before.

Why do we need the Bible?

Why did God choose this ambiguous, difficult to read, ancient book with multiple authors as His way to communicate with His elect? It surely doesn't seem like a "perfect" way... but again... I'm not infinite, so I don't know.

God chose the Bible as a way to reveal Himself to us so that we can learn, understand, and try to grasp the wholeness of His plan (which we never will).

And, you're right. Damnation and salvation can't be controlled, but I think the Bible is important to help the elect understand and accept this decision that God made.

It's not the elect who need to understand and accept, then, is it?

And you're not elect, so get over yourself.

Yes, it is the elect who need to understand. The Bible is for the elect... instructions for them.

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23-08-2012, 11:03 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(22-08-2012 09:38 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(22-08-2012 09:31 PM)Logica Humano Wrote:  I asked the same thing and I am still waiting for his answer. Ugh...

I don't want to sound pompous, stuck up or anything but I've tried asking what evidence the religious has to prove their gods above others. I've never gotten a straight answer....

The God of the Bible is the one true God because unlike the God's of any other religion, we have verifiable cases of His interaction with human history, the greatest manifestation being the person of Jesus Christ. Aside from the fulfillment of prophecy and the historical evidences that support the claims of the Bible, theologically Christianity provides the best explanation for the human condition, and only the real solution which salvation through the death and resurrection of Christ. While other religions maintain that one must simply try do as many good works to enter into the kingdom of heaven, Christianity recognizes that all of mankind has broken God's moral law and is thus worthy of punishment. Good works are insufficient for salvation just as obeying the laws of the United States are insufficient to save you from jail even if you only stole a couple cars in your lifetime.

As I have said before, if you would like to go into greater detail about historical evidences, we can do so another thread. I'm having a difficult time responding to all the questions because of limited and many questions, and I suspect I will have even less time next week when I begin classes.
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23-08-2012, 11:04 AM (This post was last modified: 23-08-2012 11:07 AM by Logica Humano.)
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 10:36 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(23-08-2012 10:22 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  What do you think about the idea that with a strict Calvinist view, any kind of Bible is unnecessary? If there is no free will, no choice whether to believe or not believe, then why bother with communicating anything at all? Election really has no bearing on anything but your afterlife, so why create an ambiguous and confusing grouping of texts that really have nothing to do with the majority of people who will ever live? When you die you'll go to heaven. When I die I'll be tortured in hell for eternity. Neither one of us can do anything about it anyway, so why bother with mythology?

I've actually asked myself this question before.

Why do we need the Bible?

Why did God choose this ambiguous, difficult to read, ancient book with multiple authors as His way to communicate with His elect? It surely doesn't seem like a "perfect" way... but again... I'm not infinite, so I don't know.

God chose the Bible as a way to reveal Himself to us so that we can learn, understand, and try to grasp the wholeness of His plan (which we never will).

And, you're right. Damnation and salvation can't be controlled, but I think the Bible is important to help the elect understand and accept this decision that God made.

Why would God need to reveal himself in the first place? What is the point of predestination if God knows all, is all, and can do all? If he controls all, why does he need to educate the "elect"?

The fact that you admit that your belief is illogical, but continue to persist, makes you all the more insane.


(23-08-2012 10:40 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(23-08-2012 10:15 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Yes, this is a faith based belief. I know.
At least you're one of the few who are able to admit this. Drinking Beverage

I found that believers proudly admit that their belief is faith-based.

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23-08-2012, 11:09 AM
RE: Ask TrueReason...Religious questions
(23-08-2012 11:03 AM)TrueReason Wrote:  Aside from the fulfillment of prophecy and the historical evidences that support the claims of the Bible, theologically Christianity provides the best explanation for the human condition, and only the real solution which salvation through the death and resurrection of Christ.

Realistically, Christianity is damaging to the human condition.

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