Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
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25-04-2012, 04:16 PM (This post was last modified: 25-04-2012 04:18 PM by houseofcantor.)
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
(25-04-2012 10:16 AM)NoahsFarce Wrote:  Neil deGrasse Tyson

FTW. Always. It's a rule...
(25-04-2012 10:15 AM)Internet Mullah Wrote:  Furthermore, I think that many of the acts of violence being done in the name of Islam has increased only in the last couple of decades.

It's an identity thing. Islam is no more violent than Buddhism.

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25-04-2012, 04:34 PM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
(25-04-2012 02:56 PM)ShirubaDangan Wrote:  Welcome to the forum!! Now sorry if I sound so critical and even if I sound rude but the fact of the matter is. I had people die in my family for such idiotic things as you stated above. I believe it to be disgusting but that has nothing to do with you. I respect your opinions and views but I will definitely question.

I believe we all will!

Hi ShirubaDangan. Thank you for your constructive reply.

I just read your post, and I think you raised a lot of good points, and that's why I'm going to give them the careful thought that they deserve and reply accordingly. But, first, if you don't mind, I'm going to answer some of the other questions posted earlier in this thread. After I do that, then I will come back to your questions when I'm ready to answer them. I'm trying to catch up with everyone who posted here, and there's a lot, but I'm still in the process of thinking about these things.
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25-04-2012, 04:43 PM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
That is completely fine. I am a patient person and you have already done much more than Egor has ever done with my posts. I welcome your answers.

"Mankind must put an end to war, or war will put an end to mankind." -John F Kennedy

The way to see by Faith is to shut the eye of Reason.” -Benjamin Franklin

It has been a long time. How have you been?
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25-04-2012, 05:40 PM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
First of all, thank you for taking the time and showing such patience in replying to all these questions, Internet Mullah.

As a female, I would likely have been stoned to death or killed in some other way a long time ago if I was living in a Muslim country. Then again, I would likely have chosen different paths and just would not be who I am today.

Stoning someone to death - that is about the cruelest, most hateful and horrific way of killing someone.

European nations did use to kill people in public and draw large audiences when people were killed by giullotine and such, and I think quite a few public hangings took place in the US too. While I consider that Barbarian also, it does not compare to stoning to death.

It is difficult for me to even comprehend how someone can be so cruel. Do people not have feelings of empathy? How can someone laugh while watching another human being dying in such incredible agony? Out of all the people there, not one comes forward to try to help that poor person? It is simply incomprehensible to me.

Yes, the old testament is full of cruelty also, but these were times when people were primitive, they behaved like animals in many ways.

Even animals have empathy, but humans with their superior brains, living in a modern world where invasions and violence are not on the daily menu, should excel in protecting, teaching and furthering their own rather than treating them in such inhumane ways.

Nothing, absolutely nothing justifies such cruelty.

Yet I have met and gotten to know quite a few Muslims in my life, and they all seemed to be as nice as the next person. How can someone be a caring, pleasant human being one minute and turn into a blood thirsty psychopath the next?

I just cannot reconcile the image of a decent, loving person with such unimaginable cruelty.

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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25-04-2012, 07:11 PM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
Why would you be a Muslim in the modern World?
The whole of the Quran is little more than hate speech. So why would you follow its "teachings"!?
Isn't it time to wash the sand out of you vaginas and move out of the dark ages?
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25-04-2012, 08:08 PM (This post was last modified: 25-04-2012 08:12 PM by Mr Woof.)
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
(25-04-2012 07:11 PM)mysticjbyrd Wrote:  Why would you be a Muslim in the modern World?
The whole of the Quran is little more than hate speech. So why would you follow its "teachings"!?
Isn't it time to wash the sand out of you vaginas and move out of the dark ages?
Mullah, in some ways I can see where you are coming from.

It seems to me that you hold Allah, seen as epitomising total knowledge, kindness, and perfection as having created humanity in a way potentially pleasing to the ideals you attribute to this force.

Even assuming that you are correct (hypothetically) some of us hold that even Allah as perceived by you, would have no moral rights to impinge his plan, and inherent suffering, on beings who arguably had no say in the matter.
Is it the right of an all powerfull Being to whip, metaphorically speaking,finite creatures into submission in order to gain some unknowable alleged paradisical state of being. To say Allah has these rights because Allah is Allah is simply circular reasoning.

It appears to me that Islam is largely geared around premises whereby women are inferior, though equally worthy in their way, to men who operate a highly patriarchal system.True, women locked into child rearing and serving their husband(s) may be happy in their roles and this may lead to a stable society in some ways; however the price paid is arguably coercion.

You failed to answer the question I raised relevant to clitorectomies perfomed on little girls? I imagine you would have answered this is one of the problems related to ignorant people unaware of the nuancing. I don't think this is good enough.

Also I read your article relating to stoning, and lashings, and how these are almost impossible to apply due to the safe guards . The fact that four people may feel embarassed and snoopy getting close enough to see the penis inside the vagina, and thus get the victim off the hook sounds odd, especially such as the law doesn't apply to anal intercourse or oral sex, not perhaps that this is encouraged, Again I would argue that where provocative laws remain on the books poor enforcers can always use them. You have mentioned Turkey and Egypt as being less tolerant in some areas.

Essentially any great mass of holy writ will contain gross human considerations that can be abused purposely, or because of ignorance, as you indicate yourself. I would even argue that there is considerable danger in militant atheism and scientism.

You appear as sincere in your beliefs an I am sincere in my disbeliefs, my choice being to pursue, as calmly as possible, the dangers inherent in both religion and secularism and thus very much engage the middle ground.
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26-04-2012, 03:01 AM (This post was last modified: 26-04-2012 03:31 AM by Mark Fulton.)
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
Internet Mullah, I’ve had a read of your responses and feel that you deserve more of an explanation from myself. I want you to continue to feel welcome and to keep posting.

Please accept that you are going to get criticized here. I'm not claiming to speak for everyone, but most here have thought long and hard about religion, including Islam, and have rejected it. Yet we want to keep learning.

Re “Mark Fulton and Mr. Woof, it seems that you guys are getting a little too upset about my views on sex and adultery.”
I can understand you think I’m upset and hot under the collar. Actually, I’m not. I chose to use colourful language for effect. I don’t criticize others to make them feel small, or to vent, or to make me feel superior. I do it to make a point. Too often religious people like you get away with saying grossly unethical things, such as implying it is ok to stone someone for sexual indiscretions. I’m not going to let you get away with it, even if I sound like a raging militant atheist. I ask you now to retract that assertion, and if you won’t, then state your position unambiguously.

Re “my opinion on adultery is primarily due to my belief in Islam and that's why I think that adultery is a sin, and that it is a crime.”
Yeah, I know. Do you think the world is impressed with the fact you hold the ignorant, delusional despot’s opinions in high regard? I assure you I don’t, and I think most of the world agrees with me, and we don’t think professing faith in Islam is a valid excuse for disgusting ethics.

I’d like you to consider the following. You are a typical Muslim apologist. You either water down (ie “interpret”) the holy book, or pick out pieces of it, thereby ignoring the unethical sections. You claim that Muslims more radical than yourself just ain’t reading it right. These excuses are weak and lame because the Koran says what it says.

You have probably been offended by my comments about Mohammed and consider them deliberately inflammatory. Yet you, in my opinion, have a respect for the prophet that he doesn't deserve. The Koran was allegedly transcribed by others based on his words, so the crux of this whole issue is Mohammed’s legitimacy. So let’s discuss that.

Who was he? An early seventh century wandering, desert dwelling trader of goods with no education, a man who knew very little of the world outside his own environment. He never studied literature, law, history, science, art, architecture or religion. He may have come across the odd Jew or even Christian, but knew bugger all about their scriptures. He was good looking, intelligent and intuitive, and married a wealthy woman, worked hard and did well for himself. With time on his hands, he started seeing and hearing messages from god/angels or whoever. There was nothing unusual about that…its standard fare in any psychiatric hospital today. Over 1% of people then and now suffer from psychotic illnesses. Nowadays psychotic people usually respond well by losing their delusions and hallucinations after a week’s worth of medication. He may well have had epilepsy too, another illness usually easily treated today.

Mohammed was ambitious and power hungry. Religion and the wielding of power were one and the same process in those days. He tried to start his own religion based on his delusions, and was at first spectacularly unsuccessful. Yet he was persistent, aggressive, cunning, confident, manipulative and lucky. He slowly built up a gang of supporters over the years, and they went on the rampage fighting and robbing
other communities. He killed many of his enemies. He had multiple wives, (as you do once you become a megalomaniac), including the wife of one of his mates and a prepubescent girl.

The gang he formed turned into an aggressive faith breathing monster. After he died they fought amongst themselves, turned him into a legend, and continued on the warpath in pursuit of power and money. The rest is history.

There is considerable doubt about how much of the Koran originated from him. We know he didn’t compile it. After his death his supposed words were found scribbled on bits of bone and leaves and Allah knows what else, and it was some decades before they were compiled into a book.

So this, in a nutshell, is the basis of an entire religion.

Why any informed, intelligent, modern person should feel compelled to live their life according to a code allegedly invented by this unwell, illiterate, pedophile tyrant is beyond me.

Yet you choose to read the drivel in the Koran as the word of god…a god you have never seen or touched and who has never talked back to you, a god that was originally invented 1000 years before Mohammed’s time by the ancient Jews!

I invite you to get real, put your brain into gear, have a shave and step into the 21st century by abandoning your toxic beliefs. Your thoughts, your freedoms and your individuality are being suppressed by power hungry Mullahs, and they do it so well, with techniques pinched from the Jews and honed over the centuries, you have no idea what has happened to you. That is ultimately what Islam is all about…the control of people…but then again, maybe you’re one of those doing the controlling?
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27-04-2012, 05:34 AM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
Boo, he didn't engage in the subject I brought up... Weeping

“We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically.”

-Neil deGrasse Tyson
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27-04-2012, 08:33 AM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
Ok, glad to see we have some people covering the disgust I'll just ask some questions then.
First clarify the requirements of an adulteress' confession. Does the other person confessing sentence you to death as well?

On the concept of stealing, the Koran holds that living is the most important law, and in it posits the idea that stealing food when you need food is not a sin even though stealing is. Does this ever get factored into civil law or is it simply an ignored passage?

As far as homosexuality, the arabic language only has a word for the man submitting as a connotation of gay (to my knowledge). Does the male penetrator still get punished, and what exactly is the restriction on women? Many arabic countries have a lot of same gendered physical interaction. Kiossing and hugging are common actions. What is the stopping point?

Lastly as with most religions the roles of men and women are clearly defined. What about those who are neither male nor female? They've always existed yet never been accounted for. Are people who do not fit the normative characteristics killed? What about transsexuals?

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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27-04-2012, 04:02 PM
RE: Ask a Muslim [split from introductions]
(27-04-2012 05:34 AM)NoahsFarce Wrote:  Boo, he didn't engage in the subject I brought up... Weeping
Thanks for posting that video. I learnt a lot from it. It would be a shame if IM has picked up his bat and ball and gone home. Maybe he's organising a goon squad to come and get me for what I said about Mohammed. If you never hear from me again you no why LOL
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