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16-07-2012, 06:44 PM (This post was last modified: 16-07-2012 06:52 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Ask a Theist!
(13-07-2012 12:46 PM)Chas Wrote:  You think logically, but not rationally. Drinking Beverage

That sums KC up nicely. 'Course Girly thinks rationality is overrated too. Not as much as religion, but still overrated. Rationality, like logic, is a tool I use on an as needed basis. I bow to no Gods, including rational ones like science. Girly don't bow. ... mainly because it might throw my back out and I won't be able to get back up.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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23-07-2012, 10:49 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(14-07-2012 04:18 AM)Zombifyit Wrote:  
(13-07-2012 12:11 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  #1 - For the same reason that I know I'm elect. There is a passion and a belief in her to want to serve God.

#2 - What I answered earlier about prayer:
Prayer is essential because it is communication with God. Most people see prayer as “Oh hai god! Heal plz. Can I have this?” Prayer, in essence, isn’t this at all. Yes, our fates our determined, but this line of communication helps us understand God. It allows Him to answer questions. He can reveal to us the “whys”. Prayer is for us. It’s not for God.

We are to pray for others in obedience. Praying for others also allows God to reveal to us how He wants us to be used, what to say, and how to act around others. Ultimately, none of that is our choice; however, prayer is use as an explanation for His purpose and a look into His will.


I guess I should have clarified that I pray, for me, to know that my children are elect. I don't pray for God to elect them; as that has already been done.
In other words, prayer doesn't do anything. Doesn't the bible itself say "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you"?
Matthew 7:7
"And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will
cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up
serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt
them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover."

Mark 16:17-18

"Such an experience happened to the apostle Paul. After being shipwrecked
and escaping to the island of Malta, Paul was bitten by a deadly snake.
The natives thought he would die, but God miraculously intervened and
Paul was not harmed (Acts 28:1-6)."

Also, studies have shown that prayer doesn't work. So what was so special about the prayer of the apostles that doesn't help with other people? If you'd drink poison, would you not be hurt? or dying? Pray for this god to heal you if you dare to drink poison. After all, god takes care of his children, right?
ANY father would. Yes

I don't think you read what I wrote.

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24-07-2012, 03:33 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Im curious to know what this 'religious experience' was that reignited your Christianity, if you would like to share it.
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25-07-2012, 08:12 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(24-07-2012 03:33 PM)Magoo Wrote:  Im curious to know what this 'religious experience' was that reignited your Christianity, if you would like to share it.

What I said in this thread.

Evidence for me being elect:

Growing up, I was always embarrassed of Christianity and whenever my parents talked about Jesus. I thought church was silly, and I found the stories nothing more than fantasy.

I finally accepted agnosticism in college as my official belief, and I began to rip Christianity apart with the use of logic and rationality. I would combat Christians on the Internet via forums and use the aforementioned tactics against them to make them look like fools. I was good at it.

Driving home from work one day, my life changed. My heart was opened to a higher power; even though I didn't know whom. I'll try my best to explain this: I found myself suddenly and sincerely praying and listening to this higher power for guidance. This was wholly strange to me because up until that moment I didn't believe in a God that I could talk to.

My beliefs so drastically changed than I began to get angry with myself. I didn't understand how I could rationally accept that there was a higher power that I could converse with. It wasn't logical. Also, I never wanted to talk to a higher power, and I didn't understand how I was doing it if I didn't choose to. My knowledge of religion pre-empted the idea that I had to choose it.

The higher power led me to read and study the Bible. This was the first time that I’ve ever actually done it. It was at this time that I realized that the higher power I was talking to was the Christian God; however, I still didn’t understand why I didn’t get a choice. As my studying intensified, I began to learn about election. And then, it made sense. I realized that then reason I didn’t have a choice is because I was never planned to have a choice.

I knew that I was elect because I learned that those who are elect can hear the will of God and those that aren’t cannot even understand it.

So, that’s my evidence. I guess the most concrete part of it is the fact that my beliefs radically changed and became cemented by no choice of my own.

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25-07-2012, 09:08 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
"I knew that I was elect because I learned that those who are elect can hear the will of God and those that aren’t cannot even understand it."

This was complete and utter nonsense then and it still is today.
Not to mention it remains incredibly arrogant. Angry

Surely those around the world who call themselves "elect" have consistent views about the world and the Great Absent One's role in it? Yet, this is not so. What you will find is inconsistency across the board. Many of those "elect" views are in direct opposition to one another. How can that be?
This inconsistency in NO way supports what KC believes to be true and preaches here. It does support ideas like a chemical imbalance in the brain and so forth.
It also demonstrates how inept the god of KC must be if it exists. It is unable to come up with a better and far more effective method of transferring information other than to mysteriously tell a few folks in a vague way and hope for the best.
A god like that is a useless turd if that is how it really operates. I mean, how many people here are convinced that KC is really "elect"?

KC refuses to consider any of the other many possibilities other than a religious explanation for his delusions. He just "knows" it to be true. He is clinging to faith a bit too hard which has led him astray of reality.

"They [religions] all make the same mistake. They all take the only real faculty we have that distinguishes us from other primates and from other animals -- the faculty of reason, and the willingness to take any risk that reason demands of us -- and they replace that with the idea that faith is a virtue. If I could change just one thing, it would be to dissociate the idea of faith from virtue, now and for good, and to expose it for what it is: a servile weakness, a refuge in cowardice, and a willingness to follow with credulity, people who are in the highest degree, unscrupulous."

~ Christopher Hitchens 9-7-2010 ~

It's all in your head, because there is no other place it could be.
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25-07-2012, 10:11 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Very interesting. Thanks Smile I think your mad Big Grin, but what you want to believe in, is what you want to believe in.
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25-07-2012, 07:32 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(25-07-2012 08:12 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(24-07-2012 03:33 PM)Magoo Wrote:  Im curious to know what this 'religious experience' was that reignited your Christianity, if you would like to share it.

What I said in this thread.

Evidence for me being elect:

Growing up, I was always embarrassed of Christianity and whenever my parents talked about Jesus. I thought church was silly, and I found the stories nothing more than fantasy.

I finally accepted agnosticism in college as my official belief, and I began to rip Christianity apart with the use of logic and rationality. I would combat Christians on the Internet via forums and use the aforementioned tactics against them to make them look like fools. I was good at it.

Driving home from work one day, my life changed. My heart was opened to a higher power; even though I didn't know whom. I'll try my best to explain this: I found myself suddenly and sincerely praying and listening to this higher power for guidance. This was wholly strange to me because up until that moment I didn't believe in a God that I could talk to.

My beliefs so drastically changed than I began to get angry with myself. I didn't understand how I could rationally accept that there was a higher power that I could converse with. It wasn't logical. Also, I never wanted to talk to a higher power, and I didn't understand how I was doing it if I didn't choose to. My knowledge of religion pre-empted the idea that I had to choose it.

The higher power led me to read and study the Bible. This was the first time that I’ve ever actually done it. It was at this time that I realized that the higher power I was talking to was the Christian God; however, I still didn’t understand why I didn’t get a choice. As my studying intensified, I began to learn about election. And then, it made sense. I realized that then reason I didn’t have a choice is because I was never planned to have a choice.

I knew that I was elect because I learned that those who are elect can hear the will of God and those that aren’t cannot even understand it.

So, that’s my evidence. I guess the most concrete part of it is the fact that my beliefs radically changed and became cemented by no choice of my own.

You did have a choice and you chose to suspend reason and critical thinking.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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26-07-2012, 04:10 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Uh oh, here comes WW3..
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26-07-2012, 05:01 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
I'm curious KC.. do you assert that any belief's are choices?

There is definitely a growing school of thought that would delegate that belief's are not choices. Not to say there is no free will, but in the case of what someone actually believes, there is not a choice being made in any instance.

You could have thoughts and understanding on subjects. But a belief is a culmination of what one thinks is correct based on their experiences, preferences, and understanding of topics.

I think that's close to the Sam Harris stance on belief. I'm curious what you think about this, whether you stand in agreement, disagreement, or undecided.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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27-07-2012, 12:16 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(25-07-2012 08:12 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  What I said in this thread.

KC, how do you keep track of everything you say in this forum? You have more than 3,700
posts and you remember what you said in each one??

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