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16-01-2012, 05:01 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(16-01-2012 04:53 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  You know, it's getting kind of creepy that you're stalking all my posts to try and add a negative spin to everything I write. Obsessed much?

Also, Bucky and TheBeardedDude, I'll respond soon... about to head home from work. I'll try to get an answer for you tonight.

Creepy? Really? Laughable.
This is creepy.
"I learned that those who are elect can hear the will of God and those that aren’t cannot even understand it."

You can HEAR what you think is the will of god? That is creepy for sure.
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16-01-2012, 11:23 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
KC...

No one is stalking you Tongue

Really.

Now just stand still, this won't hurt a bit Wink
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17-01-2012, 08:25 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
This probably has been asked before but i cant find the exact page with the search.

Why do you believe in god? ("because bible says so" is an acceptable answer because of the rule 3. but i whould like a "better" more personal answer.)

How do you define god?

If any of my current or future questions conflict with the 1. rule please excuse me because it's hard for me to tell.

Oh and also MY FIRST POST Big Grin
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17-01-2012, 02:58 PM (This post was last modified: 17-01-2012 03:27 PM by kingschosen.)
RE: Ask a Theist!
(16-01-2012 04:57 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(16-01-2012 04:53 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  You know, it's getting kind of creepy that you're stalking all my posts to try and add a negative spin to everything I write. Obsessed much?

Also, Bucky and TheBeardedDude, I'll respond soon... about to head home from work. I'll try to get an answer for you tonight.

Are you talkin' to me?

Nope.
(16-01-2012 03:00 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  I suppose I must agree with Chas here in saying that your use of the term "evidence" in this case is incorrect (The Princess Bride is awesome) and is ultimately still a faith-based belief.

Chas and I had a discussion about this, and I was very aware that my anecdote wouldn't count for evidence; still, I was pressed to share, thus resulting in what you read. But yeah, I'm aware it doesn't count as evidence.

Quote:What made you so certain that it was the Christian-God? Did you feel compelled to read the bible and that is why? If so, do you think you would have still felt compelled to read the bible if you had been raised Hindu (or any other religion)?

At that time I started reading everything in an attempt to make sense of what happened. I looked into Hinduism and Buddhism briefly. I read the Quran. I read the Satanic Bible. It wasn't until I started reading the Holy Bible that things started to make sense. 2 Corinthians 4:18 stuck out for some reason, and I continued to search the Bible for answers.

Quote:As for your time as an agnostic, were your discussions with christians directed at the historical validity of the bible or the existence of god? I ask because agnostic means you do not know, but one can still believe in god and be agnostic and one can not believe in god and be agnostic. So, when you were agnostic, did you believe that absolute knowledge of god was not possible but god still likely existed or that absolute knowledge of god was not possible and that god likely did not exist?

I believed like I do now. Just in the opposite direction. Since I'm not omniscient, there is no way that I can say whether or not God exists; however, unlike now, I lived under the almost certain assumption that a higher power didn't exists; but if he did, he was unconcerned with us or completely malevolent.

Quote:I went through a period of this and went in the opposite direction as you and I wonder why that is so. I essentially woke up one morning after years of being in what I now realize was theistic agnosticism (that is, I believed one could not know with any absolute knowledge that god exists but I still believed one did) and asked myself one simple question I had been avoiding for over a decade. The question was simply "Do I believe in God?" and I remember saying "no" out-loud (as if to reassure myself that it was me talking) and literally feeling happier and better. That was a moment of revelation to me, but it did not prove to me that god did not exist, it simply caused me to realize what I actually believe and I wonder if this moment in your car was really nothing more than the theist inside of the agnostic you taking control. When I look back at my experiences now, I realize that I had always been avoiding that question because deep down I knew my answer to that question was always "no" but fear of rejection and being alone kept me lying to myself. My period of "agnosticism" was really nothing more than the logical side of me clawing its way to the surface.

I say this not really hoping to convert you but to try and figure out what led to your conclusion because my story could have very easily mirrored your own and this may be the closest I will ever come to seeing that version of me.

My state of being, at that time, was a complete 180 from where I am today. I fought just as hard as 6.5 as I do now as a 2. If you would have seen my posts from 2006, it would mirror much of what is written on here. I was very anti-god... and I fought militantly against any theist. I hated the fact that I had become what I hated... what I was fighting against... and I didn't understand why I had become it.

It wasn't my Christian influence... because, I hated my "Christian influences" and what it stood for. I felt like I had betrayed myself when I accepted theism because I didn't understand what was going on. This is why I began to search for an answer, and how I found my answers to my questions in the Bible.

[Image: dog-shaking.gif]
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17-01-2012, 06:45 PM (This post was last modified: 17-01-2012 08:28 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Ask a Theist!
(17-01-2012 02:58 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  At that time I started reading everything in an attempt to make sense of what happened. I looked into Hinduism and Buddhism briefly. I read the Quran. I read the Satanic Bible. It wasn't until I started reading the Holy Bible that things started to make sense.

Hmmm ... makes me wonder what would have happened if you had shuffled that order around a bit. My read is that the Buddhists have a much more sophisticated understanding and appreciation of 2nd Corinthians 4:18 than Christians do.

(17-01-2012 02:58 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Chas and I had a discussion about this, and I was very aware that my anecdote wouldn't count for evidence; still, I was pressed to share, thus resulting in what you read. But yeah, I'm aware it doesn't count as evidence.

I got no problem with that. As a hypogonadal man I've been on the steroid forums for years and I've seen how the collective anecdotal evidence of steroid users over the years and decades have influenced and even driven experimental ideas and designs. Often, anecdotal evidence is all we have to start with. Wink

#sigh
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17-01-2012, 08:07 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(17-01-2012 08:25 AM)Reactor Wrote:  Why do you believe in god? ("because bible says so" is an acceptable answer because of the rule 3. but i whould like a "better" more personal answer.)

Look a few posts up. I posted what happened to me during my conversion in bold.

Quote:How do you define god?


I define God as an omnipresent, omniscient, and omnipotent being written about in the Bible defined further in the Trinity.

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17-01-2012, 08:46 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(17-01-2012 08:07 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  I define God as an omnipresent, omniscient, and omnipotent ...

I don't see no omnibenevolence there. Don't see any irreconcilable differences between that and we is god.

P.S. Give Girly a break, he stayed off the Biocentrism bandwagon for at least a week.

#sigh
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17-01-2012, 09:21 PM (This post was last modified: 17-01-2012 09:25 PM by Reactor.)
RE: Ask a Theist!
Quote:My heart was opened to a higher power
I guess that the post that contain this sentence is your explanation in my previous answer.

I am afraid i need a better explanation of what happened to you this day.
Did you heard voices? Did you heard thoughts? Did you saw anything? Did you heard anything? (I am not trying to offend you, i just want to understand what you experienced exactly)

How do you know that this was a higher power. I am assuming this was your first time experiencing it.
Why not a lower power or something else.


Quote:The higher power led me to read and study the Bible.

How exactly did it led you? Was there signs, voices or just an other feeling.


Did something "bad" happened in the close past of the day of the event that you couldn't handle by yourself and/or you needed someone to talk?(like a psychologist)
Do you feel happier now that you are Cristian?
Was you sad or melancholy before converting to Cristian?

I just want to understand you psychological background and what might pushed you to convert.

I admit that some of the questions are a bit personal and weird. xD
Just answer as many as you feel comfortable to.
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17-01-2012, 09:44 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
"I define God as an omnipresent, omniscient, and omnipotent being written about in the Bible defined further in the Trinity."

Everywhere, all knowing, and all powerful.
Yet it never lifts a finger to do anything!

KC could go ahead and Google image "starving children".
He might look at those images and then ask himself, what kind of god would sit right next to a starving, suffering kid (since god is omnipresent), knowing full well the pain and misery his apparent creation is in (since god is omniscient) while watching with apparent ability to act (since god is omnipotent) only to do nothing?
To the tune of 30,000+ people a day?
He could do that. But he won't preferring to stay happy cozy and warm peeking out at the world through god glasses.
If there is a god as KC defines him, that god is a cruel and callous sob that deserves no worship whatsoever.
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17-01-2012, 10:32 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
I have an honest question, but it might have been asked before...if so, I apologize for asking it again...

I meet lots of extreme conservatives, Republican types...but when I try to discuss with them about people that are altruistic in nature, they just don't seem to get the drift...it is all about Capitalism to them...

I mean they will nod and agree that it is great to be a monk or Jesuit or such, and to help others as long as that person is "spreading the word", but none seem to understand the gist of just "giving for the giving" or for bettering humanity for the sake of betterment...

What I don't understand is how then can these people consider themselves to be "Christian"??? I am an atheist and always have been (except for a brief time when I was indoctrinated into the Baptist cult, not because I chose to be, but my parents believed I should be)...for some weird reason, I just cannot wrap my mind around what these people are thinking...are all Christians then also Capitalists?? And do they not realize what this system is doing to humanity??

I am hoping that you will tell me that, NO, not all Christians are like that, and that there truly are some, maybe many, that really believe in helping others for no other reason than just to help...

I guess I just want to finally meet a true Christian that understands that I, as an atheist, can have the same ethics and values in life without the need for a "higher power" to direct me to make that choice...I make that choice out of pure love and respect for my fellow humans and other beings on this planet...and for our planet as well...

I hope I was able to convey my question properly...
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