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23-02-2012, 09:04 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(23-02-2012 08:24 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Rook explained it pretty well.

You have to understand that everything in His plan happens exactly as He wants it to. He is perfect, so His plan is perfect. His omnipresence allows Him to be present in all facets of time.

OK. I think I sort of get it. Universe is a 4D object (well, simple model of universe is at least), so something that looks like it's changing with time is static if viewed from outside time.
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23-02-2012, 09:08 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(23-02-2012 09:04 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(23-02-2012 08:24 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Rook explained it pretty well.

You have to understand that everything in His plan happens exactly as He wants it to. He is perfect, so His plan is perfect. His omnipresence allows Him to be present in all facets of time.

OK. I think I sort of get it. Universe is a 4D object (well, simple model of universe is at least), so something that looks like it's changing with time is static if viewed from outside time.

Yeah, it becomes a constant logical struggle to apply infinite to the finite. I know I have to correct myself a lot when it comes to this.

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23-02-2012, 09:21 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
I also liked Rooks explanation.
I find all of the discussions on here amazing when it comes to trying to prove a god or dis-prove a god. I'm pretty sure that in reality if there were a creature that had created us all and was in fact the only thing that had never required creation itself, we would never have any way of scientifically studying it. None.
It would be beyond us to even see, hear or smell. Let alone scrutinize with science.
Our science would be about as useful as the tips of our fingers at pulverizing diamonds.
God would be outside of all time as he would be the creator of time, god would be outside of our dimension, as he would be the creator of it. Not that this creature couldn't do what it wanted. None of our rules could ever apply. We could never create rules that we could even assume something like this would follow.
this creature makes the rules. This creature is the rules.
This is why I think KCs theology makes the most sense within the confines of the belief in god. I have a hard time getting my head around a god that wouldn't be in control of everything.
But i do think KC has the same problem only to a much larger degree. Whereas I can see outside the box and even imagine a god that lives only to fuck with us like the ultimate reality show, I don't think KC can envision this God.
Am I wrong KC?

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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23-02-2012, 09:28 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(23-02-2012 09:21 AM)lucradis Wrote:  I also liked Rooks explanation.
I find all of the discussions on here amazing when it comes to trying to prove a god or dis-prove a god. I'm pretty sure that in reality if there were a creature that had created us all and was in fact the only thing that had never required creation itself, we would never have any way of scientifically studying it. None.
It would be beyond us to even see, hear or smell. Let alone scrutinize with science.
Our science would be about as useful as the tips of our fingers at pulverizing diamonds.
God would be outside of all time as he would be the creator of time, god would be outside of our dimension, as he would be the creator of it. Not that this creature couldn't do what it wanted. None of our rules could ever apply. We could never create rules that we could even assume something like this would follow.
this creature makes the rules. This creature is the rules.
This is why I think KCs theology makes the most sense within the confines of the belief in god. I have a hard time getting my head around a god that wouldn't be in control of everything.
But i do think KC has the same problem only to a much larger degree. Whereas I can see outside the box and even imagine a god that lives only to fuck with us like the ultimate reality show, I don't think KC can envision this God.
Am I wrong KC?

dang bro

Well done. Really dude. You have a pretty good theological mind.

You are correct.

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23-02-2012, 10:44 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Can god duplicate himself?
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23-02-2012, 10:58 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(23-02-2012 10:44 AM)Reactor Wrote:  Can god duplicate himself?

No.

This question is a paradox. An omnipresent being cannot "duplicate" as that implies a finite presence. This is also true of His omnipotence. Creating a being just like Himself would be Himself.

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23-02-2012, 12:24 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
But he can spawn likenesses in an attempt to duplicate. Which is a constant action for King's god.

I'm not a non believer, I believe in the possibility of anything. I just don't let the actuality of something be determined by a 3rd party.
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23-02-2012, 02:03 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(23-02-2012 12:24 PM)Lilith Pride Wrote:  But he can spawn likenesses in an attempt to duplicate. Which is a constant action for King's god.

I don't follow.

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23-02-2012, 04:01 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
In the "Positiive Case for Satan" thread you said a demon is vastly different from a fallen angel. Can you elaborate on the difference?
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23-02-2012, 04:10 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(23-02-2012 04:01 PM)Ben Wrote:  In the "Positiive Case for Satan" thread you said a demon is vastly different from a fallen angel. Can you elaborate on the difference?

The Nephilim were the offspring of fallen angels and human women. They also survived the flood. It is believed that the fallen angels impregnated human women to try and corrupt the Messianic line. These Nephilim were monstrosities and abominations. I believe demons are disembodied spirits of the Nephilim. These spirits have no place in either heaven or hell, so they are cursed to wander the earth.

*The above was a traditional belief that was held for years because of the Book of Enoch. The Book of Enoch was considered canon until the Council of Nicea decided that the latter part of the books had become corrupted. In the Book of Enoch, it says that demons are the disembodied spirits of the Nephilim.*

Demons cannot be the fallen angels because demons behave differently than angels. Angels have a body, and angels are more exalted than an earthly human. Angelic actions in the Bible show no desire to garb themselves in earthly flesh much less possess someone. Satan is shown to only influence but never to possess (which would be the best way to make a human do something). Demons, on the other hand, can take direct control of a human body – a possession. This is a trait unique to demons and completely foreign to angels.

Another thing to consider is this: Why are demons constantly looking for a body? All they want is to dwell in some type of body… it doesn’t even need to be human (Legion asked to be casts into the pigs). Why would an angel want or need a body? The Nephilim were damned from the beginning and their spirits don’t have a home until the Final Judgment when all the non-elect are cast into the Lake of Fire; therefore, their disembodied EVIL spirits continually roam the earth looking for a body.

In short, the Nephilim became demons when they died… now, how they completely died out, I don’t know… or do I know if they completely died out. We could still have Nephilim blood walking around on earth today.

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