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28-02-2012, 04:58 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(28-02-2012 04:57 PM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  
(28-02-2012 04:38 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  An honest statement would be, "There are some religious people that breed hate."

Your over generalization is false.

Would you accept "There are religions that make people hate"?

Yes. Because that is true.

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28-02-2012, 05:15 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(28-02-2012 04:58 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  Yes. Because that is true.

Great.

Will you accept that religion CAN cause hate?

It's all in your head, because there is no other place it could be.
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28-02-2012, 06:05 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(28-02-2012 08:16 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(27-02-2012 09:24 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(27-02-2012 08:54 PM)Ben Wrote:  
(27-02-2012 11:13 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(24-02-2012 08:55 PM)Ben Wrote:  Does god know the exact position and momentum of an electron?

Yes.

In that case the uncertainty principle is easy to violate - just pray and you can easily learn position and momentum to arbitrary precision! Big Grin

What KC might mean is that God knows in advance how we are gonna collapse the probability waves. God knows what we're gonna measure before we measure it, like a meta-measurement Wink. Which is completely at odds with the conventional understanding of free will but perfectly consistent with KC's theology.

What Girly said.

I don't think the uncertainty principle is about wave function collapse, it's about a fundamental limitation on the amount of information that can be known about a particle no matter how much measurement you do. But anyway, the question was mostly a joke, so I'll stop pressing the matter. Smile
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28-02-2012, 06:09 PM (This post was last modified: 28-02-2012 06:15 PM by DeepThought.)
RE: Ask a Theist!
(28-02-2012 05:15 PM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  Will you accept that religion CAN cause hate?
As an example... What about politics TT? can political views cause hate?

Your so boorish and bull headed. All you see is red. All the worlds ill's are not caused by religion. It's way more complex than that.

If religion was wiped out tomorrow humanity is still pretty screwed up.

“Forget Jesus, the stars died so you could be born.” - Lawrence M. Krauss
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28-02-2012, 06:18 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Sure. Political views can and do cause hate.
In general, politicians don't fix anything but a religious politician can for sure breaks things. (insert Women's rights here)

Humanity would be FAR better off without religion.
Science would have been SO much farther ahead as well.
Even to this day, Science has to fight religion en masse to just maintain.

It's all in your head, because there is no other place it could be.
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28-02-2012, 07:12 PM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Those hypothetical situations can't be proven one way or another. Religion is deeply rooted in human psychology to some degree and the bad aspects of religion and allot of the fucked up shit people do boils down to the faulty redundant code that has outlived it's usefulness.

Thats why I don't think wiping out religion by itself will do much.. Those parts of the mind and the 'god module' will still be there ready to cause the same shitty issues.

I don't think it's as simple as "stop believing in god and the world is fixed."

“Forget Jesus, the stars died so you could be born.” - Lawrence M. Krauss
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28-02-2012, 07:25 PM (This post was last modified: 28-02-2012 10:40 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: Ask a Theist!
(28-02-2012 10:21 AM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  Having no free will is certainly NOT logical. WTF?!

Doesn't sound like you're familiar with, let alone seriously contemplated or considered the implications of Libet's experiment.

(28-02-2012 12:19 PM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  My position is not my own but what The Scientific Method has indicated and confirmed to be true.

No, the Scientific Method does not confirm "truth", that role is restricted to the artificial field of logic. Science just represents our current "best guess", always subject to change with additional observation. The Scientific Method just provides us with a rigorous and principled way of adapting our "best guess" to our continually expanding evidential basis.

(28-02-2012 10:21 AM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  My/our Atheist position is currently the only one that IS right.

My atheism is just my current "best guess" in the absence of not only evidence to the contrary, but even a testable theory or mechanism for acquiring said evidence. But I certainly don't have any sort of illusion that I AM right.

(28-02-2012 06:05 PM)Ben Wrote:  I don't think the uncertainty principle is about wave function collapse, it's about a fundamental limitation on the amount of information that can be known about a particle no matter how much measurement you do.

In machine learning research, a common tactic is to introduce an infallible, indefatigable, authoritative oracle and see where it leads algorithmically. Only difference I see between that and religion is a matter of intention and purpose.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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29-02-2012, 08:30 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(28-02-2012 06:18 PM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  Humanity would be FAR better off without religion.
Science would have been SO much farther ahead as well.
Even to this day, Science has to fight religion en masse to just maintain.

It ain't that simple from where I sit. Humanity without faith is the empty set - faith in the "I love my Gwynnies and there is a point" kinda sense - the problem of the past has been to push one's point into another. The scientific method provides the best, objective "point;" but there is tao. That one will find wrong even in right.

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29-02-2012, 08:43 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
Faith doesn't do much other than make happy feelings. If that makes you happy, then OK.
But to me, faith, and the embracing of faith, doesn't do much to advance us any.
It is Science and the application of Science to everything we do is what will move mankind forward.
Faith will remain motionless in a bubble.

It's all in your head, because there is no other place it could be.
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29-02-2012, 08:51 AM
RE: Ask a Theist!
(29-02-2012 08:43 AM)TalladegaTom Wrote:  It is Science and the application of Science to everything we do is what will move mankind forward.

Sounds like faith. Wink

I get up in the morning because the stupid monkey is done sleeping, then I see my Gwynnies. But shit don't begin until I see my Gwynnies; there's just be a monkey scratching his nutsack and looking for munchies. It's "the Gwynnies" that provide the human component.

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