Ask some questions about evolution here.
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03-10-2015, 08:03 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(03-10-2015 07:27 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Can you list some beneficial mutations. I was reading an online argument (one could hardly call it a debate) between a religious nut an atheist. The theist was stating that there are no beneficial mutations. That sounded stupid to me, I mean, why wouldn't there be beneficial mutations.

Another dumb but curious question. Do each of us carry mutations of one sort and another?

Populations of humans that have a history of herding cattle or goats and consuming milk have a mutation that persists lactose tolerance into adulthood. In other humans, lactose tolerance turns off in childhood.

Some people in England and Roma people had a mutation that conferred resistance to the Black Death. That mutation also makes them resistant to HIV.

There are many, many more.

And, yes, everyone has mutations.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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04-10-2015, 08:32 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(03-10-2015 07:41 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  ...
but what if the mutation manifests after the new life gets old enough to breed and hence 'pass on' said mutation
...

I think that's Lamarckism

(03-10-2015 11:14 PM)popsthebuilder Wrote:  
(03-10-2015 10:48 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Oh, for christ's sakes pops, I'm trying to learn a few things here and you come along and turn everything into a circus.

Go build a boat or something.
What? I'm tryin to learn too. Evolution is a real thing. I don't refute it in any way. What did I do?

You stopped asking questions.

The thread title is: Ask some questions about evolution here.

The forum section is: Ask An Atheist

Are you an atheist? If not, please ask, not tell.

Thanks.

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05-10-2015, 07:46 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
Thread split.

You can find Pops' spillage here.

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05-10-2015, 07:52 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(05-10-2015 07:46 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Thread split.

You can find Pops' spillage here.

ありがとうございます

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05-10-2015, 08:30 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(05-10-2015 07:52 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  
(05-10-2015 07:46 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Thread split.

You can find Pops' spillage here.

ありがとうございます

Couple more dumb questions.

There was a discussion a while back refuting the connection between Nazi eugenics and evolution which Creationists have always tried to conjoin. Could you discuss this? Smartass

'Nother question. What the hell is the writing on the bottom of your page? Looks Japanese or Greek or a combination of both.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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05-10-2015, 09:32 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
Oh, and Chas, you said in another thread that natural selection is not chance. What do you mean by this? It seems to me that the whole process is a haphazard chance. What am I missing here? The environment pressure that is placed on each species is by chance.

This confuses me. Huh......Hobo.........Big Grin

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
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05-10-2015, 09:43 PM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(05-10-2015 07:52 PM)Metazoa Zeke Wrote:  
(05-10-2015 07:46 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Thread split.

You can find Pops' spillage here.

ありがとうございます

я люблю использовать Интернет, а также. я просто пукнул.

Official ordained minister of the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Please pm me with prayer requests to his noodly goodness. Remember, he boiled for your sins and loves you. Carbo Diem! RAmen.
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05-10-2015, 09:43 PM (This post was last modified: 05-10-2015 09:55 PM by DLJ.)
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(05-10-2015 09:32 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Oh, and Chas, you said in another thread that natural selection is not chance. What do you mean by this? It seems to me that the whole process is a haphazard chance. What am I missing here? The environment pressure that is placed on each species is by chance.

This confuses me. Huh......Hobo.........Big Grin

Think about this ... do you think that environmental pressures are random?

Or did they also evolve (in the colloquial sense) i.e. change over time?

A process (any process) is simply a defined mechanism usually involving a series of inputs, activities/actions and outputs. 'Chance' is not part of that equation.

Here's Dawkins' Mount Improbable:
[Image: tumblr_inline_mwk1qzluSr1qgfyua.png]

Evolution is slow (very slow) change over time ... the gently slope.

Creationists would have us thinking that evolution is saying that we jump to the top of the cliff when they talk about things happening by chance ... for example, 'irreducible complexity' pretty much claims that the gentle slope does not / can not exist.

The irony being that a creationist is actually saying that their god lifted us to the top of the cliff my magic.

There again, I suppose one could fall off the cliff by chance ... that chance gust of wind (or a meteor wiping out the dinosaurs) but even that could be argued to be 'not chance' if one has a purely deterministic worldview.

Big Grin

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06-10-2015, 02:45 AM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(05-10-2015 09:32 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Oh, and Chas, you said in another thread that natural selection is not chance. What do you mean by this? It seems to me that the whole process is a haphazard chance. What am I missing here? The environment pressure that is placed on each species is by chance.

This confuses me. Huh......Hobo.........Big Grin

Well their is no chance, but in the end the traits are selected. Mutations have chance to them, but not natural selection, as it selects the random mutations.

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06-10-2015, 03:04 AM
RE: Ask some questions about evolution here.
(05-10-2015 09:32 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  Oh, and Chas, you said in another thread that natural selection is not chance. What do you mean by this? It seems to me that the whole process is a haphazard chance. What am I missing here? The environment pressure that is placed on each species is by chance.

This confuses me. Huh......Hobo.........Big Grin


Let's try an example.


Take a look at our own ancestors, tree dwelling primates in northern Africa. Now when the environment changed and the jungles gave way to the open plains of the Savannah, our tree dwelling ancestors found themselves in a tough position. The selective pressure being applied to them by their environment was changing. Whereas before the environment favored those who were well adapted to living up in the canopy of trees, now that trees were becoming scarce to the point of not being able to travel between them without dropping to the ground, our ancestors had to adapt. Now traits that were helpful to surviving and moving on the ground where more valuable and conducive to successful survival, and moving among the trees was becoming obsolete.

Now in this situation, a mutation that in any way improved survival on the ground, was now favored by selective pressures. So between the pressure placed by the environment, and natural random mutation, we saw the advent of bipedality; which allowed for faster movement on the ground while keeping our heads elevated high enough to watch out for predators. We gradually lost our dexterity with our feet as our posture forced us to focus on our hands, helping in the development and usage of tools.

So mutations are random, and there is always an element of chance in the life of any individual. But across time and a population, there are certain pressures that favor or disfavor certain traits, and those who have favorable traits tend to do better than those without. The more successful live longer and breed more successfully, and thus those advantageous traits spread throughout a population.

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