Atheism and morality
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26-05-2015, 06:44 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
(26-05-2015 06:26 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Your beliefs contradict observations in evolutionary biology and biological behaviors (like altruism).

How so?
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26-05-2015, 06:46 PM
Atheism and morality
(26-05-2015 06:44 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(26-05-2015 06:26 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Your beliefs contradict observations in evolutionary biology and biological behaviors (like altruism).

How so?

Like your rejection of culture being a behavior and behaviors being heritable.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-05-2015, 06:50 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
(26-05-2015 06:46 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(26-05-2015 06:44 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  How so?

Like your rejection of culture being a behavior and behaviors being heritable.

No, I said culture is more than behavior, encompassing values and beliefs, and symbols as well.

My rejection was primarily of your seeming support for memetics, and your equivocation of biological and cultural evolution, as if they are one and the same.
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26-05-2015, 06:51 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
Late to the party here, but I've got to address something that's been bugging me as I've caught up on the last dozen pages or so. I'll take it back to Tomasia's comparison of honor killings and one's taste in fashion.

It irks me that no one brought up the false equivocation here. In order for the comparison to be fair, the perpetrator of the fashion faux pa would have to be murdered for their transgression.

Only then are the two situations even close to being comparable, and I would argue that, in both, the reasons for the end action of murder is still completely subjective and, if you ask me, stupid and irrational. So that whole scenario would be irrelevant to this discussion.

Just had to throw that in, carry on.... Drinking Beverage

But now I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.

~ Umberto Eco
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26-05-2015, 06:51 PM
Atheism and morality
(26-05-2015 06:50 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(26-05-2015 06:46 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Like your rejection of culture being a behavior and behaviors being heritable.

No, I said culture is more than behavior, encompassing values and beliefs, and symbols as well.

My rejection was primarily of your seeming support for memetics, and your equivocation of biological and cultural evolution, as if they are one and the same.

Values = behavior
Beliefs = behavior
Symbols = related to language...a behavior

Evolution is a biological process. Culture is a biological behavior.

Unless you can explain a culture that emerged independent of biology?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-05-2015, 06:52 PM
Atheism and morality
Your rejection of evolution explaining culture, is not congruent with science.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-05-2015, 06:54 PM
Atheism and morality
And keep in mind, not all biology exhibits culture. Just like not all species care for their young.

And not all traits can be traced to a single gene. Like nest building.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-05-2015, 06:57 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
(26-05-2015 06:51 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Values = behavior
Beliefs = behavior
Symbols = related to language...a behavior

Evolution is a biological process. Culture is a biological behavior.

Unless you can explain a culture that emerged independent of biology?

lol, i'm not sure as to why you think putting an equal sign between these things, makes it true. Is truth a behavior too? Or just beliefs? Values and Beliefs are not synonymous with behavior. I can behave contrary to my own beliefs and values.
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26-05-2015, 06:59 PM
Atheism and morality
(26-05-2015 06:57 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(26-05-2015 06:51 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Values = behavior
Beliefs = behavior
Symbols = related to language...a behavior

Evolution is a biological process. Culture is a biological behavior.

Unless you can explain a culture that emerged independent of biology?

lol, i'm not sure as to why you think putting an equal sign between these things, makes it true. Is truth a behavior too? Or just beliefs? Values and Beliefs are not synonymous with behavior. I can behave contrary to my own beliefs and values.

You can also behave contrary to your most basic survival instincts. So what?

Please explain how values, beliefs, and culture are not behaviors of a biological organism and that they can arise independent of biology and exist without biology.

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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26-05-2015, 07:00 PM
Atheism and morality
Or to out it another way, can a mineral have values, beliefs, and/or culture?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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