Atheism and morality
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
23-05-2015, 11:31 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
(23-05-2015 11:27 PM)evenheathen Wrote:  Jesus walks into a bar, puts three nails on the counter and asks, "Can you put me up for the night? "

Ba dum........tshhh.

Big Grin

"Oh, and can you have a Roman soldier wake me up?"
"Just have him gimme a poke." Hobo
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 4 users Like pablo's post
24-05-2015, 01:46 AM
RE: Atheism and morality
there is no such thing as absolute morality



Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Ace's post
24-05-2015, 01:57 AM
RE: Atheism and morality
(23-05-2015 04:05 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I've noticed that many atheists believe in an absolute morality. That is, that some things are "really right" and others are "really wrong" regardless of any particular human's opinion. I'm curious to hear from members here about this. Obviously, morality is a very simple problem for theists.....God decides what is moral for them, but I want to hear from atheists who feel that there is a rightness and wrongness (good and evil) property of our actions. I believe that we all just make up our own set of morals, and that nothing in the universe except humans, really cares if you save the world, or destroy an entire nation of people. It's not that I don't want to be moral, quite the contrary, I try to use the golden rule and I try to be completely honest all the time. I just don't want to delude myself into believing that some things are "really right" or "really wrong" when the logical part of my mind tells me this is impossible.

Thoughts?

My thoughts?

You smell like a concern troll.

By the way, all morality is relative.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-05-2015, 04:26 AM
RE: Atheism and morality
1 - Atheism is not a moral paradigm. Can we get past this already?

2 - The correct percentage of skin that a woman should cover is precisely zero. Science FTW.

[Image: ZF1ZJ4M.jpg]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like houseofcantor's post
24-05-2015, 07:18 AM
RE: Atheism and morality
(23-05-2015 06:33 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  Here Sam Harris asserts that values can be reduced to facts. I'm a big fan of Sam Harris, but I have to disagree with him here. What do you guys think?

I would say that he's claiming that values that aren't based on facts are often counter-productive. What would you base values on other than the facts of how they affect individuals and society?

Quote:Maybe it's just a pet peeve I have with the way people talk.

From what I've seen, you are far too literal. One a somewhat related note, I'm finding it harder and harder to believe that you aren't a theist of some sort.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like unfogged's post
24-05-2015, 08:05 AM
RE: Atheism and morality
(23-05-2015 04:05 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I've noticed that many atheists believe in an absolute morality. That is, that some things are "really right" and others are "really wrong" regardless of any particular human's opinion. I'm curious to hear from members here about this. Obviously, morality is a very simple problem for theists.....God decides what is moral for them, but I want to hear from atheists who feel that there is a rightness and wrongness (good and evil) property of our actions. I believe that we all just make up our own set of morals, and that nothing in the universe except humans, really cares if you save the world, or destroy an entire nation of people. It's not that I don't want to be moral, quite the contrary, I try to use the golden rule and I try to be completely honest all the time. I just don't want to delude myself into believing that some things are "really right" or "really wrong" when the logical part of my mind tells me this is impossible.

Thoughts?

The first question to ask is not what is right and what is wrong but what is morality and why do we need it. Those are the crucial questions.

Morality or ethics is a set of chosen values to guide one's actions and choices. If you stop here then it would apear that morality is subjective but there is more.

Why do we need such a code? The reason is that like all living things we face a fundamental alternative, life or death. All living things require values in order to live. Plants need water and sunlight and minerals from the ground. Animals need food, shelter and water. Humans require all these things too but unlike the other animals they are not born with automatic knowledge. We must discover what is good for us and what is bad. Since what is good or bad for us is determined by our natures as Human beings, this is where the objectivity comes into the picture.

We are free to choose any action we want. We are not free to choose our nature and the values that we need to live. Those are fixed. We can no more change them than we can change the laws of nature. That is what makes morality objective. We must choose a standard of value by which to measure the good against the bad. That standard is life. Whatever is harmful to Human life qua Human is bad. Whatever is supportive is the good. And if we are to live together then we need to recognize that every man is an end in himself, that his life belongs to him and he must be free to think and to act on his own judgement to further his own good. That means we must keep our hands off each other unless someone initiates force against others. Then we have a rational, objective basis on which to act, life as the standard of value. Not the whim of the moment, not the dictates of a leader or a society or the tribe or the commands of a god but man's nature as man and the things his life requires to flourish.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like true scotsman's post
24-05-2015, 12:41 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
Actually, mammals and birds at least are not born with automatic knowledge, this is proven many times over when young are raised without parents. They neither know how to feed themselves nor how to fit into the often very intricate social structures of their peers.

Just saying, humans aren't all that special. Every animal that lives in groups has to learn a social structure and each group has "morals" which it enforces.

We just don't call it morals with animals, nor should we call it that with humans. It is merely a set of rules that has to be followed by members of a society unless one wants to attract the wrath of one's peers. (no wrath of gods needed Tongue)

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 6 users Like Dom's post
24-05-2015, 04:42 PM
Atheism and morality
(23-05-2015 04:05 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I try to use the golden rule and I try to be completely honest all the time. I just don't want to delude myself into believing that some things are "really right" or "really wrong" when the logical part of my mind tells me this is impossible.
Why can't things be really wrong? Why can't it be really wrong to torture babies just for the fun of it? Why is this impossible?

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-05-2015, 05:01 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
(24-05-2015 04:42 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(23-05-2015 04:05 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I try to use the golden rule and I try to be completely honest all the time. I just don't want to delude myself into believing that some things are "really right" or "really wrong" when the logical part of my mind tells me this is impossible.
Why can't things be really wrong? Why can't it be really wrong to torture babies just for the fun of it? Why is this impossible?


Psalm 137:9

"Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones."

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 11 users Like dancefortwo's post
24-05-2015, 05:24 PM
RE: Atheism and morality
I am largely a moral relativist who does not believe in hard line absolutes.
While some issues can be pretty clear, most are not.
By our personal experience we can develop some gut feeling as to how we
should best conduct ourselves socially, an din the pursuit of our own pleasures.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Mr Woof's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: