Atheism is a position with assumptions...
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03-01-2015, 10:27 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
Nature is all there is.

Now you might think that the words nature and all are the keys words here, but really the word is, is the key word.

Is represents that which exists.

If you are talking about anything else, you are referring to something that doesn't exist.

Now then, you can have many conversations about gods that don't exist and assert that they lie outside nature or outside the realm of philosophical naturalism. These conversations might lead you to better understand you and your fellow man or woman.

But rest assured, if something exists, then it is by definition part of nature. If you believe that something holds the two properties of existence and non-existence at the same time, then that's a tricky wicket.

Good luck to ya

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03-01-2015, 10:31 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 10:00 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(03-01-2015 01:58 AM)Brownshirt Wrote:  As I've said I think many atheists are philosophical naturalists but don't want the burden. Chas has not denied it, just said he never said that. Not the same thing.

I am agnostic toward philosophical naturalism. Don't make assumptions about people's beliefs - it just makes you a fool.

So I would presume you to be atheistic towards it as well? Or does that lack of belief only come out on special occasions?
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03-01-2015, 10:34 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 10:27 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Nature is all there is.

Now you might think that the words nature and all are the keys words here, but really the word is, is the key word.

Is represents that which exists.

If you are talking about anything else, you are referring to something that doesn't exist.

Now then, you can have many conversations about gods that don't exist and assert that they lie outside nature or outside the realm of philosophical naturalism. These conversations might lead you to better understand you and your fellow man or woman.

But rest assured, if something exists, then it is by definition part of nature. If you believe that something holds the two properties of existence and non-existence at the same time, then that's a tricky wicket.

Good luck to ya

That you can't grasp the potential of something being unknown and equate it to non-existent is your issue.

You need to provide an answer from nature to account for existence to make your claim plausible. You have not so you haven't.
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03-01-2015, 10:38 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 08:35 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  Well that wasn't worth wading through the fluff throughout your post.

No, I can't imagine that you have the capability to comprehend what I wrote, so there is that.



(03-01-2015 08:35 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  You have no evidence to validate naturalism as a explanatory conclusion. Thank you.

What? Naturalism has ALL of the evidence you stupid fuck (it does by definition, which you would know, if you had been paying attention). That being said, does it know or explain everything, up to and including the origin of everything? No. Is that even a legitimate or sensible question? We don't know enough to even answer that. Is there anything close to being a better supported, more reasonable, more evidence based approached? Not even close.

The unknown is not an argument against philosophical naturalism. The unknown is not an argument against anything. Ignorance is just that, ignorance; and attempting to use it as a tool ironically only belies the depth of your own ignorance.



(03-01-2015 08:35 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  You just assume I'm a theist as an attempt to validate your own assumption. Well 'your' perspective is worse than mine as unfortunately for you I'm not a theist, and I don't insert any bullshit there (Including philosophical naturalism).

You're a shit troll, atheist or not. Drinking Beverage



(03-01-2015 08:35 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  Evidence may work bitch, but only if you have some. That you think I'm trying to justify a god is your own hangup, not a fault in my position. I haven't claimed anything, particularly as self-contradictory as philosophical naturalism.

Who's projecting now?

Actually, stating that philosophical naturalism is 'self-contradictory' is a claim. Mind backing that up, instead of just your usual back-pedal dancing bullshit?



(03-01-2015 08:35 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  Once again try not to get mad, please write something with some semblance of value. If you claim not to consider philosophical naturalism to be true, then don't push evidence (which is fundamentally lacking) to answering the riddle of existence, assuming just makes you as fundamental as other beliefs.

Mad? Bro, you don't rate high enough to get me mad. I'm just using colorful base language for your benefit, in the hopes that a retarded shitheel like yourself might gleam some small measure of understanding. Because I care.

So what exactly are you arguing? That because nobody has evidence for the start of all existence, naturalism is bunk? Because that's just fucking stupid (in addition to the fact that the logic doesn't follow), and if you want to argue that, be my guest.

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03-01-2015, 10:41 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 09:22 PM)Free Wrote:  
(03-01-2015 09:08 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  You've demonstrated that you lack the ability to address the reasoning presented, and your focus on my username and gene inferiority beliefs are hypocritical. Don't worry I know you won't understand, just chuck back some more generic pejoratives. That seems to be where you excel, well, excel for you.

I understand, but tell me something ... as someone most certainly out of his league intellectually, how small do you feel among the vastly superior minds on this forum?

I'm trying to decide who's dimmer between you and Jack. What do you think?
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03-01-2015, 10:45 PM (This post was last modified: 03-01-2015 10:51 PM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 10:34 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  You need to provide an answer from nature to account for existence to make your claim plausible. You have not so you haven't.

No.

Naturalism doesn't have to have an explanation for 'everything' in order to be a valid and useful epistemology. The unknown is simply unknown, and as soon as it is known, guess what? It's natural you stupid fuck! Why? Because unless you can show it, you don't know it. So to know it, we need evidence. We can only have evidence for the natural, on account of that's how shit works because we're natural creatures in a natural universe. All evidence is physical, and thus natural. Supernatural evidence doesn't exist.

There may be things that exist outside of the natural universe, but by definition, we will never have evidence for them. So they will always remain unknown. So basing any sort of judgement off of that is epistemological weaksause, you stupid cunt. Drinking Beverage

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03-01-2015, 10:52 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 10:45 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(03-01-2015 10:34 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  You need to provide an answer from nature to account for existence to make your claim plausible. You have not so you haven't.

No.

Naturalism doesn't have to have an explanation for 'everything' in order to be a valid and useful epistemology. The unknown is simply unknown, and as soon as it is known, guess what? It's natural you stupid fuck! Why? Because unless you can show it, you don't know it. So to know it, we need evidence. We can only have evidence for the natural, on account of that's how shit works on account of being natural creatures in a natural universe. All evidence is physical, and thus natural. Supernatural evidence doesn't exist.

There may be things that exist outside of the natural universe, but by definition, we will never have evidence for them. So they will always remain unknown. So basing any sort of judgement off of that is epistemological weaksause, you stupid cunt. Drinking Beverage

You retard, you need to read up on what you believe in before you start writing irrelevant posts.
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03-01-2015, 10:54 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 10:52 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  You retard, you need to read up on what you believe in before you start writing irrelevant posts.

No, you actually need to post something worth responding to instead of continuously back-pedaling everything someone hands you your ass on a platter, because you clearly don't know shit.

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03-01-2015, 11:05 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
If you intend to defend philosophical naturalism, go learn what it is. As I've said before methodlogical naturalism is considered true by theists, agnostics and atheists. It's not my fault you're ignorant of its meaning.

consider today to be a learning day better still just keep quiet when there are big words being used.
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03-01-2015, 11:10 PM
RE: Atheism is a position with assumptions...
(03-01-2015 10:31 PM)Brownshirt Wrote:  
(03-01-2015 10:00 PM)Chas Wrote:  I am agnostic toward philosophical naturalism. Don't make assumptions about people's beliefs - it just makes you a fool.

So I would presume you to be atheistic towards it as well? Or does that lack of belief only come out on special occasions?

It is clear that you do not understand the meanings of the words agnostic and atheistic. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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