Atheism is the only rational position to take
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
17-09-2017, 09:52 AM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 09:31 AM)Naielis Wrote:  
(17-09-2017 09:24 AM)DLJ Wrote:  By that reasoning ...

Do you believe in fairies?

No? OK, so you an unbeliever. Therefore you must be an atheist.

Bravo. Welcome to the club.

Drinking Beverage

I don't think you understood what I said. The term unbeliever encompasses the term atheists because the term unbeliever refers to those who don't believe on Christ. That is not to say that it is equivalent to the term atheist. I demonstrated that at least some unbelievers must have beliefs which directly contradicts the statement "unbelievers don't have beliefs".

I don't think you understood what I said.

The term unbeliever refers to those who don't believe in Mohammed and Allah.

Christians and Jews and atheists are therefore unbelievers.

Obviously.

Cool

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes DLJ's post
17-09-2017, 09:54 AM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 09:52 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(17-09-2017 09:31 AM)Naielis Wrote:  I don't think you understood what I said. The term unbeliever encompasses the term atheists because the term unbeliever refers to those who don't believe on Christ. That is not to say that it is equivalent to the term atheist. I demonstrated that at least some unbelievers must have beliefs which directly contradicts the statement "unbelievers don't have beliefs".

I don't think you understood what I said.

The term unbeliever refers to those who don't believe in Mohammed and Allah.

Christians and Jews and atheists are therefore unbelievers.

Obviously.

Cool

I believe in Allah. It's Jesus I have a problem with. That shit's just idolatry.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like Aliza's post
17-09-2017, 10:23 AM (This post was last modified: 17-09-2017 01:23 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 09:31 AM)Naielis Wrote:  
(17-09-2017 09:24 AM)DLJ Wrote:  By that reasoning ...

Do you believe in fairies?

No? OK, so you an unbeliever. Therefore you must be an atheist.

Bravo. Welcome to the club.

Drinking Beverage

I don't think you understood what I said. The term unbeliever encompasses the term atheists because the term unbeliever refers to those who don't believe on Christ. That is not to say that it is equivalent to the term atheist. I demonstrated that at least some unbelievers must have beliefs which directly contradicts the statement "unbelievers don't have beliefs".

Oh ... so now specific language all of a sudden makes a difference ... yet you claim you can use analogies when discussing the gods, and exceptions are to be made for that.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
17-09-2017, 10:58 AM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 09:13 AM)Naielis Wrote:  
(16-09-2017 08:47 PM)DLJ Wrote:  [Image: tumblr_ldow012jAt1qbwmdbo1_r1_500.jpg]

The question is... did you?

[Image: fallcy1.jpg]

The term unbeliever encompasses the term atheist. That means that, if atheists have beliefs, then at least some unbelievers have beliefs. And yet they had said unbelievers didn't have beliefs.
Quit playing silly word games. Atheists have all sorts of beliefs, and are not opposed to beliefs that are justifiable / substantiatable. It just happens that they withhold belief from gods because it doesn't meet the test of being a supportable / credible belief. "Unbeliever" as generally used implies "one who doesn't believe in gods" and in practice quite often, "one who doesn't believe in your particular god". It does NOT mean "one who is devoid of any belief about anything".
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like mordant's post
17-09-2017, 11:03 AM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 09:31 AM)Naielis Wrote:  I demonstrated that at least some unbelievers must have beliefs which directly contradicts the statement "unbelievers don't have beliefs".

The question is, do all atheists share the same beliefs? No, they don't. The answer is the same to the question, do all theists share the same beliefs? Of course not.

So no, you can't address atheists as if we all share some monolithic worldview which can be easily refuted by anyone who is still studying philosophy in college.

If you want to address atheists, as more than a few people have now pointed out, you have to learn something about what we really think first. Address individual points. You can't just address the Christian version of what we think, because Christians routinely lie about us. If you only address what Christian think, you are just trying to spread the same lies about us too -- which is an odd thing to do in an atheist forum.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 6 users Like Thoreauvian's post
17-09-2017, 01:42 PM (This post was last modified: 17-09-2017 02:34 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 11:03 AM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  The question is, do all atheists share the same beliefs? No, they don't. The answer is the same to the question, do all theists share the same beliefs? Of course not.

So no, you can't address atheists as if we all share some monolithic worldview which can be easily refuted by anyone who is still studying philosophy in college.

Very true. As I have discussed with Girly and HoC, the positions of European contemplative Christianity, (or where they end up anyway, ... the *Dark Night of the Soul* (as written about by *saints*) John of the Cross, Teresa of Avila, and the "Desert Fathers", (John of Ford etc) among others, Eastern Tao mysticism, classical agnosticism, and Medieval "contemplative" Christianity, as exemplified in the Medieval classic, "The Cloud of Unknowing", http://www.catholicspiritualdirection.or...owing.pdf, and to some degree Duns Scotus, are all essentially the same position. Drawing lines between complex positions is very much a dead-end enterprise. Christianity may be one route, but is not special, and as a matter of fact this was (surprisingly) agreed to by my friend, who was (not *is* ) the Abbott of one of the most famous Cistercian monastic foundations in the world, (located in Kentucky Tongue ), who has been trying to "convert" me for years, and this summer, during our annual visit, confessed to me, that I had converted him. Big Grin

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like Bucky Ball's post
17-09-2017, 04:39 PM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 10:58 AM)mordant Wrote:  ...
Quit playing silly word games.
...

B-but, I was having fun.

Weeping

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes DLJ's post
17-09-2017, 05:29 PM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 09:13 AM)Naielis Wrote:  The term unbeliever encompasses the term atheist. That means that, if atheists have beliefs, then at least some unbelievers have beliefs. And yet they had said unbelievers didn't have beliefs.

Besides just playing with semantics, you're misunderstanding the difference between religious belief, or "faith", and scientific belief, or "theories".

Religious faith is defined as belief without evidence (gods, miracles, prayer, angels, virgin birth, resurrection etc). Scientific theories define phenomena that are observable and replicable (magnetism, electricity, combustion, gravity, nuclear fission, vaccination etc).

And as an atheist, I'm definitely not an "unbeliever" in God or gods. I can't not believe in something that simply doesn't exist. Assuming you believe in God, then as far as leprechauns and unicorns go, you too are an "unbeliever". I hope. Confused

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes SYZ's post
17-09-2017, 06:45 PM
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
(17-09-2017 01:42 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  Christianity may be one route, but is not special.

I'm fixing to go full Jesus very soon now. And by full Jesus I mean self-abrogation through intentional and willful self-deconstruction and dissolution. Knew I was gonna eventually go full Siddhārtha when I was 15. Held off for 40 years until I could acquire sufficient defined benefits so that nobody gets crucified this time around. Just checked with the OPM calculator. That time is 3 Aug 2018, the day after I turn 56.

I feel like the wait was worth it. .... Me and JohhnyC gonna start us a Church. Yes

#sigh
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes GirlyMan's post
17-09-2017, 06:53 PM (This post was last modified: 17-09-2017 07:03 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Atheism is the only rational position to take
Dismissing preposterous notions, for which there is no evidence, and having no foundation in reason is not "unbelief". They merit nothing but dismissal, and no further consideration. They require no formal position be taken with regard to them. They are dismissed and forgotten. It's the amateurs that wrestle with them, constantly. The pros move on to more important things, and never look back.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like Bucky Ball's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: