Atheist morality.
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15-11-2014, 08:24 AM
RE: Atheist morality.
(14-11-2014 11:21 PM)Stuffed_Assumption_Meringue Wrote:  
(14-11-2014 10:40 PM)StorMFront Wrote:  We in the West think its ethical to eat with a fork and knife.
Wait. What?

Yea, bad example. Yet I was trying to refer to the differences in our table manors.

Arguing with a Christian is a lot like playing chess with a pigeon. You can be the greatest player in the world, yet the pigeon will knock over all the pieces, shit on the board and strut away triumphantly.
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15-11-2014, 08:37 AM
RE: Atheist morality.
(15-11-2014 08:24 AM)StorMFront Wrote:  
(14-11-2014 11:21 PM)Stuffed_Assumption_Meringue Wrote:  Wait. What?

Yea, bad example. Yet I was trying to refer to the differences in our table manors.

I'm guessing this would be ethics then... In England/America it's supposedly noted that having your elbows on the table is bad manners. In France elbows on the tables is welcomed and it's in effort to wanting to have your hands above the table at all times which is good manners.

I don't think anything brought up in the OP is off base from what is frequently concluded here. So I'd say it not really any new perspective or continued questioning reall.

But it think sometimes the terms subjective/relative get misattributed to mean the same thing or one but not the other, so that point I'm not certain which is actually meant.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
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15-11-2014, 09:00 AM
RE: Atheist morality.
(15-11-2014 08:24 AM)StorMFront Wrote:  ...
the differences in our table manors.

That's etiquette not ethics.

We will have different qualms and peculiarities if we are 'to the manners, born'.

Dodgy

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15-11-2014, 09:13 AM
RE: Atheist morality.
(15-11-2014 09:00 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(15-11-2014 08:24 AM)StorMFront Wrote:  ...
the differences in our table manors.

That's etiquette not ethics.

We will have different qualms and peculiarities if we are 'to the manners, born'.

Dodgy

Manners maketh man. Tongue

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15-11-2014, 09:56 AM
RE: Atheist morality.
(14-11-2014 08:52 PM)Shadow Fox Wrote:  
(14-11-2014 08:02 PM)StorMRising Wrote:  I tend to use this as my go to morality comment when asked. Opinions are appreciated.

Atheists derive their morals the same way religious people do. We did not get our morality from some bronze age goat herders mythology. It was an accumulation of philosophical ideologies over the centuries.
Morality is subjective, which known history demonstrates. Even in the religious world view that it is. Christians once endorsed slavery, torture and executions of non-believers, burning of witches and many other atrocities. Which are taboo now in western societies. (Christians still do that stuff in Asia and Africa).
We are evolved social primates with inherent evolutionary traits, such as communication, intelligence, altruistic tendencies and emotions like empathy. These evolutionary traits allow us to place ourselves into other peoples shoes. Which we can produce thought experiments, like "I wouldn't want to be shot, so I doubt you would either". Which we can then convoy the thought experiments to others to see if they agree. Which if the majority agree we then can produce laws and consequences for breaking those laws.
No deity needed, it is just the inherent and objective nature of a social animal we are, that we come to similar conclusions on moral issues.

I think you have a slight confusion here.

Morals are Objective. They are objective to the way our evolutionary processes have gone over the years. ETHICS on the other hand is what is Subjective. Slavery is not really a moral choice but more an ethical one based on what the population believes at the time. Morality never changes, Ethics does, but the two are so interconnected to each other that it is difficult to tell which is which.

For example, murder. Murder is wrong no matter what culture you are in. However, because of the ethics of a certain time, it can be "morally", and by morally I actually mean ethically, correct to kill someone if they have opposing ideals that are against the holy book of whatever region you are from.

Ethics are driven from an outside source, this outside source can be anything from a holy book written by the ethical standards of others from any other period of time, to people in your community or whatever.

Morality exists in every social animal species on the planet. They are Objective because that is how evolution has brought us up to survive as a species.

For example, there is a moral stigma against killing each other for no reason.
Why? Because in order to kill someone, we need a reason to be afraid of them such as a fear of our lives ending because of that person. If we simply walked around and killed each other for no reason than our species would come to an end.

Sex with small children is a morality issue. They are not able to procreate, therefor, sex with children is morally wrong since it provides no purpose and they are still at the age where maternal and paternal instincts should still be in place that causes us to want to protect them from harm, be it physical or psychological which the act of sex would harm them in both.

The act of having sex with a minor whom is capable of making children is an Ethical choice based on many factors and continues to evolve over time today. It would not surprise me if the age of consent would be pushed to 20-21 in the next 100 years. This is also due to the fact that our species no longer needs to copulate with minors in order to keep the species alive.

So, while you are correct in saying we all have the same morality ( aside from some mentally defective people. ) Our ethics on the other hand are not all the same and that is where a lot of people get confused. People often confuse a ethical choice over a moral one.





quote :
"for example
if we want to raise our children to be happy and well adjusted adults
then it necessarily follows that we ought not torture them in their infancy
however if we have no interest what so ever in promoting the health, happiness, or emotional well being of children
then there is no real good reason to refrain from torturing babies now is there"
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