Back to school prayer
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31-08-2017, 01:13 PM
Back to school prayer
Someone posted this on the local school FB page.

[Image: Back-to-School-Prayer.jpg]

There were all kinds of 'Amen' and prayer hand emoji replies.

What cracks me up is a couple of the so-called 'christians' who replied with Amens or "I just LOVE this!" are fairly repugnant people with equally demon spawn children.

I am so tempted to post this:

[Image: f5b91d4cf9a5d5b9ad0416fe847c777d--momma-...quotes.jpg]

"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu."

[Image: parodia-michal-aniol-flying-spaghetti-monster.jpg]
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31-08-2017, 01:20 PM
RE: Back to school prayer
Also, the biggest opponents (at least in my state) for anti-bullying laws are the religious right. They claim either freedom of religion, or that there's not really a problem, so there's nothing to fix.
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31-08-2017, 01:56 PM
RE: Back to school prayer
(31-08-2017 01:13 PM)ShadowProject Wrote:  Someone posted this on the local school FB page.

[Image: Back-to-School-Prayer.jpg]

There were all kinds of 'Amen' and prayer hand emoji replies.

What cracks me up is a couple of the so-called 'christians' who replied with Amens or "I just LOVE this!" are fairly repugnant people with equally demon spawn children.

I am so tempted to post this:

[Image: f5b91d4cf9a5d5b9ad0416fe847c777d--momma-...quotes.jpg]

Actually, aside from appealing to a god and the mindless praise and fawning, what's left (about 80%) are some pretty good sentiments.

....

... but yeah, hypocrites gonna hypocrite.

"If I ignore the alternatives, the only option is God; I ignore them; therefore God." -- The Syllogism of Fail
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01-09-2017, 04:52 AM
RE: Back to school prayer
Praying really doesn't do a damn thing. As if that needed to be said.
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01-09-2017, 08:02 AM
RE: Back to school prayer
(31-08-2017 01:20 PM)RobbyPants Wrote:  Also, the biggest opponents (at least in my state) for anti-bullying laws are the religious right. They claim either freedom of religion, or that there's not really a problem, so there's nothing to fix.

I wish I could understand how bullying became such a problem.
I don't doubt that it's real but I can't really get down with "laws" about it.
It seems like an over reaction to start passing laws if it's just kids having a scrape on the playground. That was part of growing up when I was a kid.
I can't say I bullied or that I got bullied. But everybody had at least a few playground dust ups over the years. Hell I ended up good friends with a couple of kids after we fought.
It's an issue that I just find myself a bit mystified about. How did this become a big problem?

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01-09-2017, 09:43 AM
RE: Back to school prayer
(01-09-2017 08:02 AM)BikerDude Wrote:  
(31-08-2017 01:20 PM)RobbyPants Wrote:  Also, the biggest opponents (at least in my state) for anti-bullying laws are the religious right. They claim either freedom of religion, or that there's not really a problem, so there's nothing to fix.

I wish I could understand how bullying became such a problem.
I don't doubt that it's real but I can't really get down with "laws" about it.
It seems like an over reaction to start passing laws if it's just kids having a scrape on the playground. That was part of growing up when I was a kid.
I can't say I bullied or that I got bullied. But everybody had at least a few playground dust ups over the years. Hell I ended up good friends with a couple of kids after we fought.
It's an issue that I just find myself a bit mystified about. How did this become a big problem?

It's a lot more than scrapes on the playground. It's not a new issue or a new problem, but it is newly-visible.

Children are, let's face it, sociopaths. Lots of them are more interested and curious about learning and mastering how to affect their environment -- including other people -- than particular cognizant of the damage that causes. Children revel in the power to cause any impact they can, whether it's making loud noises or building things or drawing on walls or throwing food halfway across the room. Empathy isn't something that comes easily to them, at least not yet. The ability to cause pain to others is the power to affect one's environment.

This unrecognition of harm caused tapers off in late childhood and into adolescence, but it's replaced by a need for social acceptance and anxiety about one's social status. This combines vulnerability -- a sense of desperately fearing one's own failure to make it good in the social hierarchy -- and opportunity -- the idea that bringing others low causes one's own relative position to rise. Eventually, going into adulthood, these needs subside to a manageable level, but adolescence is kinda fraught with whacked priorities and poor reasoning due to the brain reshaping itself.

None of this is new. What IS new is an increased recognition of the problem, coupled with an increased scope for it to manifest itself in.

First, recognition. Psychologists are increasingly noticing that a lot of adult problems stem from childhood and adolescent trauma. Teachers and parents are becoming more compassionate and more aware. There's less of a boys-will-be-boys laissez-faire attitude and more attentiveness. Traditionally bullies have targeted those of a lower social class, often minorities that won't be quickly defended and are less likely to report: immigrants, racial minorities, religious minorities, LGBT, people with psychological conditions. (Note that some of these are targets of the Religious Right as well.) This might be because they're an easy target, but can also be because they sense that there will be less opposition to attacks against these targets. With increased compassion for how minorities are treated comes an increased awareness of how they're being targeted.

The cultural concept of the ideal person is less about individual strength and ruggedness (something which a physical bully personifies and a victim does not) and more about social citizenship, which increasingly makes physical bullies stick out like a sore thumb. The nature of bullying has shifted to match, becoming more a sort of psychological warfare with the goal of hurting feelings and social standing than physical bruising. These days, the extreme of bullying is less likely to leave the target as a beaten and bloody pulp, and more likely (coupled with issues like depression) to drive them to suicide. These tactics have meshed effectively with social media, creating a social space mostly unmonitored by adults where bullies can pursue their targets 24/7. The suicide rate linked to bullying, combined with a growing desire to view suicide as something to be proactively prevented, is another factor in increased visibility and the push to do something about it.

I agree that outlawing bullying won't be effective. The basics of social domination are too ingrained in the human psyche, the typical playground bully is too ignorant of and apathetic to fine points of law, social bullying is non-violent and thus treated less harshly, a lot of the time it's difficult to single out particular bullies out of a mob of harassers for punishment, and since bullying is usually (though far from always) something minors do it doesn't feel right to punish them harshly. However, laws that create initiatives for study or education or authorize agencies to take preventative of monitoring actions make sense, as do laws moving bullies into reformative programs or separating them from their victims.
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01-09-2017, 09:56 AM
RE: Back to school prayer
(01-09-2017 09:43 AM)Reltzik Wrote:  
(01-09-2017 08:02 AM)BikerDude Wrote:  I wish I could understand how bullying became such a problem.
I don't doubt that it's real but I can't really get down with "laws" about it.
It seems like an over reaction to start passing laws if it's just kids having a scrape on the playground. That was part of growing up when I was a kid.
I can't say I bullied or that I got bullied. But everybody had at least a few playground dust ups over the years. Hell I ended up good friends with a couple of kids after we fought.
It's an issue that I just find myself a bit mystified about. How did this become a big problem?

It's a lot more than scrapes on the playground. It's not a new issue or a new problem, but it is newly-visible.

Children are, let's face it, sociopaths. Lots of them are more interested and curious about learning and mastering how to affect their environment -- including other people -- than particular cognizant of the damage that causes. Children revel in the power to cause any impact they can, whether it's making loud noises or building things or drawing on walls or throwing food halfway across the room. Empathy isn't something that comes easily to them, at least not yet. The ability to cause pain to others is the power to affect one's environment.

This unrecognition of harm caused tapers off in late childhood and into adolescence, but it's replaced by a need for social acceptance and anxiety about one's social status. This combines vulnerability -- a sense of desperately fearing one's own failure to make it good in the social hierarchy -- and opportunity -- the idea that bringing others low causes one's own relative position to rise. Eventually, going into adulthood, these needs subside to a manageable level, but adolescence is kinda fraught with whacked priorities and poor reasoning due to the brain reshaping itself.

None of this is new. What IS new is an increased recognition of the problem, coupled with an increased scope for it to manifest itself in.

First, recognition. Psychologists are increasingly noticing that a lot of adult problems stem from childhood and adolescent trauma. Teachers and parents are becoming more compassionate and more aware. There's less of a boys-will-be-boys laissez-faire attitude and more attentiveness. Traditionally bullies have targeted those of a lower social class, often minorities that won't be quickly defended and are less likely to report: immigrants, racial minorities, religious minorities, LGBT, people with psychological conditions. (Note that some of these are targets of the Religious Right as well.) This might be because they're an easy target, but can also be because they sense that there will be less opposition to attacks against these targets. With increased compassion for how minorities are treated comes an increased awareness of how they're being targeted.

The cultural concept of the ideal person is less about individual strength and ruggedness (something which a physical bully personifies and a victim does not) and more about social citizenship, which increasingly makes physical bullies stick out like a sore thumb. The nature of bullying has shifted to match, becoming more a sort of psychological warfare with the goal of hurting feelings and social standing than physical bruising. These days, the extreme of bullying is less likely to leave the target as a beaten and bloody pulp, and more likely (coupled with issues like depression) to drive them to suicide. These tactics have meshed effectively with social media, creating a social space mostly unmonitored by adults where bullies can pursue their targets 24/7. The suicide rate linked to bullying, combined with a growing desire to view suicide as something to be proactively prevented, is another factor in increased visibility and the push to do something about it.

I agree that outlawing bullying won't be effective. The basics of social domination are too ingrained in the human psyche, the typical playground bully is too ignorant of and apathetic to fine points of law, social bullying is non-violent and thus treated less harshly, a lot of the time it's difficult to single out particular bullies out of a mob of harassers for punishment, and since bullying is usually (though far from always) something minors do it doesn't feel right to punish them harshly. However, laws that create initiatives for study or education or authorize agencies to take preventative of monitoring actions make sense, as do laws moving bullies into reformative programs or separating them from their victims.

Dude chill out, children aren't sociopaths.
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01-09-2017, 10:21 AM
RE: Back to school prayer
I think the biggest difference I see is schoolyard crap used to be left on the schoolyard. With social media and 24/7 connection, kids have found all sorts of new ways to be cruel.

"If you don't have a seat at the table, you're probably on the menu."

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01-09-2017, 10:30 AM
RE: Back to school prayer
I don't know what areas you had around where even before technology of phones and social media, I never saw stuff just left to the playgrounds.

No, people go to other people's houses or at least chase em down past their homes and houses.

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01-09-2017, 12:28 PM (This post was last modified: 01-09-2017 01:16 PM by BikerDude.)
RE: Back to school prayer
(01-09-2017 10:30 AM)ClydeLee Wrote:  I don't know what areas you had around where even before technology of phones and social media, I never saw stuff just left to the playgrounds.

No, people go to other people's houses or at least chase em down past their homes and houses.

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Well whatever. Schoolyard is being used metaphorically. It's a term "a school yard fight" or whatever you want to call it. I admit I never suffered anything more that the occasional scuffle and nothing long lasting of psychically damaging. Whatever that is.
I guess I'm just wondering if kids have changed or parents have changed.
And my concern is that older kids seem to have really changed.
I feel like I'm seeing young people who are unequipped to cope with any slight or criticism? And an attitude that anything unpleasant is not fair. Think trigger alerts and safe zones yadda yadda. Is it related? I don't know. I'm just thinking the MAYBE we might have over adjusted and we are coddling a bit? Just wondering. And don't get me wrong. I am not defending bullying.
I mean really everyone really just wants to raise healthy kids. And the way we go about that changes from time to time.
But is it possible to impose a form of neglect unintentionally that results in kids never developing the skills to deal with certain difficulties?
Oh boy. I just can't help but stir the pot.




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