Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
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14-08-2014, 07:39 PM
Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
For those of us who know about and understand Evolution, we have ALL been in a debate with someone else about whether or not it's real. We know that Evolution is a FACT and that Special Creation isn't. But there are places across this country where it's legal to teach Creationism and/or Intelligent Design in Public School Science classes.

I live in one of the states where that's the case. I live in Louisiana in the heart of the Bible Belt and even the politicians here are doing everything in their power to undermine Science Education. In 2008 they passed a law called The Louisiana Science Education Act, Act 473 (SB733) of 2008. So far there have been 4 attempts to repeal this bill, all of which have met with failure. The LSEA was based on the Discovery Institute's academic freedom model statute. Which if you don't know the Discovery Institute is basically the Headquarters for Intelligent Design.

From this point on I will group the terms ID and Creationism together. ID was found to be nothing more than an edited version of Creationism. This farce was uncovered in the Tammy Kitzmiller, et al. v. Dover Area School District, et al. (400 F. Supp. 2d 707, Docket no. 4cv2688), which lasted from September through December in 2005. When original copies of the Creationist literature (then the flagship literature for ID) were found with a number of hasty edits changing terms within the book to hide it's true nature, ID was found to be exclusively religious and not scientific at all. Creationism had already been labeled "Unscientific" in more than 11 prior court cases. So we know that neither has any place in science classes.

Not only is Creationism illegal to teach in school at all as it violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment which states;
Quote:Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,...
Which means that our government and by extension all federally funded establishments may not establish a national, state or city wide religion nor may they endorse any one religion over any other.

By teaching Creationism in Public Schools we are essentially teaching children to be Christians. It's already illegal to teach Creationism as per the first amendment but that's not stopping politicians from trying to worm it into curriculum. I propose a country wide ban on the teaching of Creationism in all public schools. But that will never happen unless we force the United States Government to take notice. Fortunately you can start petitions on the whitehouse.gov website. I encourage anyone here from the United States to click the following link and please sign the petition. Thank you.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petitio...n/hJ3zmwVn

I hope this doesn't get moderated. While I am the one who created this petition I sincerely hope this isn't taken as a promotional post since I gain absolutely nothing from this.

Also, please if you would share this link where ever you can get support for it. I've included a shortURL for spreading around. Thank you again for your time and support Smile .

http://wh.gov/luPb0

Ban Creationism in Public Schools in the United States. Sign The Petition, CLICK HERE!
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16-08-2014, 11:48 PM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
With how stupid this country is, I doubt that it will get the signatures needed.

Now if a "miracle" happens and we do get enough. It might be something nice. I doubt the Right wing Conservatives will allow this to ever happen though. They will play the religion card and one thing will lead to another in them might being able to force creationism to replace evolution in schools setting our country back 200 years.


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17-08-2014, 08:32 AM (This post was last modified: 17-08-2014 08:51 AM by Res Publica.)
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
If we are going to "teach the controversy" then why are we silencing all these poor people from having their "theories" heard. If we are going to spend time in science classes teaching something completely unsupported and contradicted by science, they shouldn't every nut (religious or otherwise) get his bullshit theory taught as well?

And this is where the entire "teach the controversy" bullshit line falls apart. Why teach the controversy about something scientifically uncontroversial in science class. And even if it we did accept that it should be taught, why should only the Christian "theory" be taught? The "teach the controversy" people would lose their shit if Hindu, Moslem, Sikh or Buddhist creation myths were being taught. What they really want is special treatment for their religion. It is obvious that they don't give a shit about science, but they don't really give a shit about "the controversy" either.

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17-08-2014, 08:50 AM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
(17-08-2014 08:32 AM)Res Publica Wrote:  If we are going to "teach the controversy" then why are we silencing all these poor people from having their "theories" heard. If we are going to spend time in science classes teaching something completely unsupported and contradicted by science, they shouldn't every nut (religious or otherwise) get his bullshit theory taught as well?

And this is where the entire "teach the controversy" bullshit line falls apart. Why teach the controversy about something scientifically uncontroversial in science class. And even if it we did accept that it should be taught, why should only the Christian "theory" be taught? The "teach the controversy" people would lose their shit if Hindu, Moslem, Sikh or Buddhist creation myths were being taught. What they really want is special treatment for their religion. it is obvious that they don't give a shit about science, but they don't really give a shit about "the controversy" either.

Precisely. This isn't about them wanting to have all religions taught in schools, just theirs. I'd like to see the look on their faces when the class decides to go over ALL of the batshit crazy religions. they would most likely come up with some half-assed excuse as to why any religion that's not theirs shouldn't be taught.

I say offer a class that revolves around the various religions of the world. That would promote more understanding if anything.

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17-08-2014, 08:52 AM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
(17-08-2014 08:50 AM)Hamata k Wrote:  
(17-08-2014 08:32 AM)Res Publica Wrote:  If we are going to "teach the controversy" then why are we silencing all these poor people from having their "theories" heard. If we are going to spend time in science classes teaching something completely unsupported and contradicted by science, they shouldn't every nut (religious or otherwise) get his bullshit theory taught as well?

And this is where the entire "teach the controversy" bullshit line falls apart. Why teach the controversy about something scientifically uncontroversial in science class. And even if it we did accept that it should be taught, why should only the Christian "theory" be taught? The "teach the controversy" people would lose their shit if Hindu, Moslem, Sikh or Buddhist creation myths were being taught. What they really want is special treatment for their religion. it is obvious that they don't give a shit about science, but they don't really give a shit about "the controversy" either.

Precisely. This isn't about them wanting to have all religions taught in schools, just theirs. I'd like to see the look on their faces when the class decides to go over ALL of the batshit crazy religions. they would most likely come up with some half-assed excuse as to why any religion that's not theirs shouldn't be taught.

I say offer a class that revolves around the various religions of the world. That would promote more understanding if anything.

Or teach only science in science class.

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18-08-2014, 02:02 AM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
I don't want to live in this country anymore.

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18-08-2014, 02:45 AM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
My opinion is that ID/creationism should never be even considered for inclusion in science classes until it can stand up to the same scientific scrutiny as evolution.

Even if we allowed an elective course of some sort in world religion/creationism/ID into public schools, where would we fit it in the curriculum?
Would some other course(s) need to be dropped to make room for it?
If so, which existing courses would be deemed less important?
Who gets to make that decision? Creationists?

The entire idea of jamming this down the throats of our kids seems about as realistically thought out as their beliefs.
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18-08-2014, 03:05 AM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
Creationism is religious, so they can learn it at their places of worship. Drinking Beverage

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18-08-2014, 11:12 AM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
(14-08-2014 07:39 PM)Higgs Boson Wrote:  For those of us who know about and understand Evolution, we have ALL been in a debate with someone else about whether or not it's real. We know that Evolution is a FACT and that Special Creation isn't. But there are places across this country where it's legal to teach Creationism and/or Intelligent Design in Public School Science classes.

I live in one of the states where that's the case. I live in Louisiana in the heart of the Bible Belt and even the politicians here are doing everything in their power to undermine Science Education. In 2008 they passed a law called The Louisiana Science Education Act, Act 473 (SB733) of 2008. So far there have been 4 attempts to repeal this bill, all of which have met with failure. The LSEA was based on the Discovery Institute's academic freedom model statute. Which if you don't know the Discovery Institute is basically the Headquarters for Intelligent Design.

From this point on I will group the terms ID and Creationism together. ID was found to be nothing more than an edited version of Creationism. This farce was uncovered in the Tammy Kitzmiller, et al. v. Dover Area School District, et al. (400 F. Supp. 2d 707, Docket no. 4cv2688), which lasted from September through December in 2005. When original copies of the Creationist literature (then the flagship literature for ID) were found with a number of hasty edits changing terms within the book to hide it's true nature, ID was found to be exclusively religious and not scientific at all. Creationism had already been labeled "Unscientific" in more than 11 prior court cases. So we know that neither has any place in science classes.

Not only is Creationism illegal to teach in school at all as it violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment which states;
Quote:Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,...
Which means that our government and by extension all federally funded establishments may not establish a national, state or city wide religion nor may they endorse any one religion over any other.

By teaching Creationism in Public Schools we are essentially teaching children to be Christians. It's already illegal to teach Creationism as per the first amendment but that's not stopping politicians from trying to worm it into curriculum. I propose a country wide ban on the teaching of Creationism in all public schools. But that will never happen unless we force the United States Government to take notice. Fortunately you can start petitions on the whitehouse.gov website. I encourage anyone here from the United States to click the following link and please sign the petition. Thank you.

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petitio...n/hJ3zmwVn

I hope this doesn't get moderated. While I am the one who created this petition I sincerely hope this isn't taken as a promotional post since I gain absolutely nothing from this.

Also, please if you would share this link where ever you can get support for it. I've included a shortURL for spreading around. Thank you again for your time and support Smile .

http://wh.gov/luPb0

The problem is that we don't really have a national school system. Each state/county/local school decides on what is taught, who teaches it, and which books are approved. Many already do a piss poor job at teaching biology anyway and still more avoid even talking about evolution by natural selection all together.

Each fight becomes individual.


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And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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20-08-2014, 10:00 PM
RE: Ban Creationism is Public Schools!
Anyone have any idea how many signatures the petition got?


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