Batman is an Asshole...
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16-01-2016, 04:56 AM (This post was last modified: 16-01-2016 05:11 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
(16-01-2016 04:36 AM)666 Wrote:  @EK, You're essentially telling me Batman is useless, and Gotham is better left alone without him.

I want you to imagine a Gotham without Batman. Now imagine a Gotham with Batman.
Where would you rather move out with your family given that these are the only 2 options available?


Gotham would be better served by Bruce Wayne the philanthropist, rather than Bruce Wayne the masked vigilante.


If he really cared enough to help the masses of Gotham City and improve their lot, he'd use his considerable wealth and intelligence far more constructively than personally beating the shit out of low-level gang members and the mentally unstable. Build a factory or two to create jobs, invest in the city's education and infrastructure, offer job training and affordable day care, or any of another dozen or so things that Bruce Wayne could make happen with a checkbook to vastly improve the lives of the citizens of Gotham. But no, he's on the ground kicking the shit out of the people ignorant and desperate enough to work for the Joker and Penguin; and he uses his considerable wealth to facilitate this activity instead of undermining and genuinely fixing the broken environment itself. One has to wonder, given his supposed intelligence and massive wealth, if he does continue to do this because this is what he enjoys more? Is he not doing all he can because this is how he gets his rocks off? It now at least makes sense, but this also turns Batman into a sadistic asshole; and there's no way to really sidestep that realization. You can try to ignore it or hand wave it away, much like you're trying, but that doesn't change the reality of the scenario that is Gotham City and Batman's role therein.


The city is plagued by problems, ones that we have real-world solutions for, and Batman who posses both the intelligence and the means to make these fixes a reality chooses instead to beat people up with his fists. That's almost Jesus level douchebaggery right there (being a faith healer who only cures a small handful of blind and crippled people, instead of telling everyone about how germs really work). Also, he paid for the JLA space station. He could fucking purchase Gotham in every meaningful way, and being a masked vigilante that operates outside the law, why isn't he also a powerful political patron? Why doesn't he also buy off the government, if he's going to do it for the betterment of the people, and his character has already established that he's more than comfortable with ends justifying their means? He already sidesteps police authority, what's a little bribery and political patronage if it makes the city better for everyone?


Simple answer? He enjoys kicking the shit out of people more than doing any of that, which is precisely why he hasn't done any of that in favor of continuing to kick the shit out of people. It's the simplest answer that makes the least amount of unnecessary assumptions. Occam's razor strikes again.

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16-01-2016, 07:02 AM
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
(15-01-2016 11:26 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(15-01-2016 03:53 PM)onlinebiker Wrote:  Pretty much.. . But even worse -- they're subjective tastes over things which don't even really exist.

Having an opinion is fine.

Having an opinion about stuff that's not even real is just a waste of time...

Not even real?

They're just as 'real' as any other story, real or fiction. Take a true story, change the names of the people involved, does that make the story any less 'real'? Just by the nature of attributing their actions to fictitious avatars, does that in and of itself make their story less compelling? I didn't need Matt Damon or Tom Hanks to become 'real' astronauts to enjoy The Martian or Apollo 13. Thank goodness Alan Rickman didn't have to die for 'real' at the end of Die Hard for that movie to be compelling. Television, film, and video games are each multi-billion dollar industries that employ millions; making the pursuit of the unreal certainly more than 'just a waste of time'.

Humans clearly have the capacity for being emotionally invested in unreal things, it's part of what makes having an imagination fun.

Having fun with fiction is fine.

Getting emotionally invested with unreality is not.

...

Get emotionally invested with REALITY.

Leave emotionally invested in fiction to the religious.

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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16-01-2016, 07:06 AM
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
(16-01-2016 12:51 AM)666 Wrote:  No.
Batman is a symbol of hope. He gives hope to the world through his strong view against killing in his quest to fight crime and his uncompromising wrath against evil.

Batman is awesome.

Without killing the criminals or just the main ones it hardly could be called uncompromising wrath. It's rather resemble chasing and intentionally not catching the rabbit as to have something to do.

Also while I know Batman only from games the no killing rule is broken regularly for how unconcious man with broken bones can survive such cold as in virtual Gotham? Compared to this killing would be a mercy.

Such rule I feel make more trouble than it is worth cause conscience of one means shit when compared to ammount of suffering which death of Joker or others would have prevented.

So Batman could be awesome but he is far from practical.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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16-01-2016, 07:14 AM
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
(16-01-2016 07:06 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  
(16-01-2016 12:51 AM)666 Wrote:  No.
Batman is a symbol of hope. He gives hope to the world through his strong view against killing in his quest to fight crime and his uncompromising wrath against evil.

Batman is awesome.

Without killing the criminals or just the main ones it hardly could be called uncompromising wrath. It's rather resemble chasing and intentionally not catching the rabbit as to have something to do.

Also while I know Batman only from games the no killing rule is broken regularly for how unconcious man with broken bones can survive such cold as in virtual Gotham? Compared to this killing would be a mercy.

Such rule I feel make more trouble than it is worth cause conscience of one means shit when compared to ammount of suffering which death of Joker or others would have prevented.

So Batman could be awesome but he is far from practical.

Kind of like a person who goes fishing and once having torn up a fish's mouth so they'll bled to death throws them back in the water??
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16-01-2016, 07:24 AM
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
(16-01-2016 07:14 AM)DerFish Wrote:  
(16-01-2016 07:06 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Without killing the criminals or just the main ones it hardly could be called uncompromising wrath. It's rather resemble chasing and intentionally not catching the rabbit as to have something to do.

Also while I know Batman only from games the no killing rule is broken regularly for how unconcious man with broken bones can survive such cold as in virtual Gotham? Compared to this killing would be a mercy.

Such rule I feel make more trouble than it is worth cause conscience of one means shit when compared to ammount of suffering which death of Joker or others would have prevented.

So Batman could be awesome but he is far from practical.

Kind of like a person who goes fishing and once having torn up a fish's mouth so they'll bled to death throws them back in the water??

I'm not sure what do you mean. That Batman is cruel? It appear so. Ineffective? That too. Overly concerned with his conscience and causing more suffering in result? Again, yes.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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16-01-2016, 08:29 AM (This post was last modified: 16-01-2016 08:35 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
(16-01-2016 07:02 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(15-01-2016 11:26 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Not even real?

They're just as 'real' as any other story, real or fiction. Take a true story, change the names of the people involved, does that make the story any less 'real'? Just by the nature of attributing their actions to fictitious avatars, does that in and of itself make their story less compelling? I didn't need Matt Damon or Tom Hanks to become 'real' astronauts to enjoy The Martian or Apollo 13. Thank goodness Alan Rickman didn't have to die for 'real' at the end of Die Hard for that movie to be compelling. Television, film, and video games are each multi-billion dollar industries that employ millions; making the pursuit of the unreal certainly more than 'just a waste of time'.

Humans clearly have the capacity for being emotionally invested in unreal things, it's part of what makes having an imagination fun.

Having fun with fiction is fine.

Getting emotionally invested with unreality is not.

...

Get emotionally invested with REALITY.

Leave emotionally invested in fiction to the religious.


Emotional investment is not a zero sum game. Like many things, moderation is key. To be obsessive is unhealthy, but the other extreme? To have no investment? No attachment? To feel nothing, and never be moved by anything, because you cannot invest yourself in it?

I'd rather not be dead inside, thank you.

Fiction allows you to explore ideas and concepts that we otherwise cannot, or possible shouldn't, in real life. Things such a exploring what it means to be human through the lens of artificial intelligence or trans-humanism. Alternatively we can explore the very concept of the divine as well. Fiction allows us to experiment with ideas and explore concepts that are otherwise normally out of our grasps.

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16-01-2016, 10:00 AM
RE: Batman is an Asshole...
The main issue here is "Shared Universe" something DC is toying around with removing. If the same Batman that is in the Detective comic is also in JLA as a literal God (currently Batman is in possession of the mobius chair and is a new god) that is where you have a problem. If they are not the same Batman then you can have your cake and eat it too. Batman the detective and the Dark Knight of Gotham need not be hyper rich on an insane scale (No JLA no Watchtower) and he can be street level. However when you have Batman literally beating up God (it's happened) and being so hyper intelligent that he can solve any Cosmic Crisis with no super powers then him going around gotham and punching thugs is an issue.

The basis of the Batman character is inside under the kung-fu master and world's greatest detective, under the mask and costume Bruce Wayne is still that 8 year old boy standing in an alley watching his parents die. He is not an emotionally stable adult so he can't look at the root cause for things, he needs it to be as simple as "bad guy + punch = fighting crime" Bruce Wayne has been called out several times for exactly this, once during the Night of Owls he showed his then girlfriend the Batcave and she said more or less exactly what Bob said. Batman is not the correct approach to crime it is a revenge fantasy and nothing epitomizes that more than the Tie-in for Darkseid War "Batman God of Knowledge" what does he do with Omniscience and Omnipresence? He punches bad guys and tortures the man that killed his parents.




(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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