Before the Big Bang
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21-04-2017, 03:31 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
This came immediately to mind:

Quote:In 2005, a peer-reviewed scientific journal published results of the tests. It turns out that chromosome 2, which is unique to the human lineage of evolution, emerged as a result of the head-to-head fusion of two ancestral chromosomes that remain separate in other primates. Three genetic indicators provide strong, if not conclusive, evidence of fusion. First, the banding (or dye pattern) of human chromosome 2 closely matches that of two separate chromosomes found in apes (chimp chromosome 2 and an extra chromosome that does not match any other human chromosome). Second, a chromosome normally has one centromere, or central point at which a chromosome's two identical strands are joined. Yet remnants of a second, presumably inactive centromere can be found on human chromosome 2. And third, whereas a normal chromosome has readily identifiable, repeating DNA sequences called telomeres at both ends, chromosome 2 also has telomere sequences not only at both ends but also in the middle.

...well, and then the google part. Tongue

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21-04-2017, 03:31 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
(21-04-2017 03:24 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  I didn't want to start another thread so I'll post this here. I was reading something online and a theist said the following:

"Francis Crick proved himself - the DNA molecule cannot evolve"

I think the theist was trying to discredit evolution. In saying DNA can't evolve he is saying we did not evolve.

I am a complete idiot when it comes to this sort of thing, but I thought DNA doesn't evolve because it is just the actual building blocks of life. In other words, DNA drives the evolution and doesn't itself evolve?
I'm not very well read on this subject, but to my knowledge its not that DNA "evolves", but more part of that DNA "mutates", which is essentially the basis for evolution. This may happen at complete random or be a selective breeding choice, (mixing the genes of two very different animals) but that's how I understand that it works.

This is also why evolution, on the scale that we know it, takes millions/billions of years, because a random mutation may not be visibly any different in the next generation, but when those genes are mixed with other mutations, and so on, the eventual results come to pass. You can alter DNA as well, so show previous mutations. I saw a documentary where scientists alter DNA of chicken embryos, to show previous changes to it's DNA. The changes were visible in the later formed chicken embryo, showing different evolutionary stages, such as having more bones/longer tails and so on.

I once saw a study that suggested your DNA does change, on a personal level, depending on your level of fitness. So if you keep in tip top shape, you DNA slightly alters to reflect this. I'm not sure if this would then reflect in the next generation, but there you have it.

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21-04-2017, 05:11 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
Gott's trumpet. I love this thing. Imma steal it and put it in mai religion. Tongue

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21-04-2017, 05:35 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
From House of Cantor's link:

"The phases through which chromosomes replicate, divide, shuffle, and recombine are imperfect, as DNA is subject to random mutations. Mutations do not always produce harmful outcomes. In fact, many mutations are thought to be neutral, and some even give rise to beneficial traits."

“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.” ~ Oscar Wilde
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21-04-2017, 05:39 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
Yeah... the use of language is very important. "Evolving" can mean lots of different things in different contexts. If someone wants to pick holes in a scientific theory, they have to be very precise about what they actually mean.

So what this particular guy means by "DNA evolving", I could only guess. If he means the very concept of how DNA works evolving into something else, well... yeah. But no one is claiming that this happens. So often, people are disputing things that the theories don't say.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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21-04-2017, 07:02 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
(21-04-2017 03:24 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  I am a complete idiot when it comes to this sort of thing, ...

Well then!*

[Image: 51lQlvzbD7L.jpg]

[Image: EvolutionForDummies.jpg]

*I've owned at least a dozen copies of each. I give them to my cousins who seem to have at least a few functioning brain cells.
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21-04-2017, 08:49 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
(21-04-2017 07:02 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  
(21-04-2017 03:24 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  I am a complete idiot when it comes to this sort of thing, ...

Well then!*

[Image: 51lQlvzbD7L.jpg]

[Image: EvolutionForDummies.jpg]

*I've owned at least a dozen copies of each. I give them to my cousins who seem to have at least a few functioning brain cells.
Are the idiot/dummy books any good? I get the impression you shouldn't take them too seriously

“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.” ~ Oscar Wilde
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21-04-2017, 09:53 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
(21-04-2017 08:49 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  
(21-04-2017 07:02 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  Well then!*

[Image: 51lQlvzbD7L.jpg]

[Image: EvolutionForDummies.jpg]

*I've owned at least a dozen copies of each. I give them to my cousins who seem to have at least a few functioning brain cells.
Are the idiot/dummy books any good? I get the impression you shouldn't take them too seriously
They're intro level books, don't assume much. One of the ones I listed above covered the development of evolutionary theory while the other goes into the nuts-and-bolts. They complement each other.

And if you make me get up and go see which is which I shit in your kitty litter.

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21-04-2017, 10:56 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
(21-04-2017 09:53 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  
(21-04-2017 08:49 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  Are the idiot/dummy books any good? I get the impression you shouldn't take them too seriously
They're intro level books, don't assume much. One of the ones I listed above covered the development of evolutionary theory while the other goes into the nuts-and-bolts. They complement each other.

And if you make me get up and go see which is which I shit in your kitty litter.

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Fair enough Big Grin

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21-04-2017, 11:00 AM
RE: Before the Big Bang
(21-04-2017 10:56 AM)SeaJay Wrote:  
(21-04-2017 09:53 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  They're intro level books, don't assume much. One of the ones I listed above covered the development of evolutionary theory while the other goes into the nuts-and-bolts. They complement each other.

And if you make me get up and go see which is which I shit in your kitty litter.

[Image: deadpool-pole-dancing-quere.gif?w=387&h=260]
Fair enough Big Grin

I'm a liberal arts major, because the other majors sounded like work, and those books made evolution clear to me. One of the people I gifted said was the starting of his road to a Ph.D. in biology.
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